Explaining non calls out of your primary to coaches.

[JRutledge]

I am only going to talk to a coach when the ball is clearly dead or when I have a real opportunity. I am not talking to a coach about a play during live ball for the most part.

If the call was clearly not in my area or I did not get a good look at it, I will ask the coach to ask the official that was in the best position to make the call. And I will tell them I cannot comment on something I was not looking at or tell them what I was focused on.

Also I just explain what I saw if I feel the coach really is asking, not just commenting. For example I will not respond if a coach says, "That has got to be a foul."

I will admit that I have gone back and forth as to what I actually do and I have learned some things work and others do not work. And most of all how you deal with coaches is very personal and can change from one game to another.

Peace

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Hate this one. I would recommend never using this.

This is giving the coach permission to say to your partner next time he's close, "Hey, your partner says you missed one over there, what the hell are you guys watching?!?"

A simple, "He's got a much better angle, coach," or, "I was officiating these players here. You can ask him when he's over here, coach," work very well.

Everyone has their own style. Remember, I'd only use that IF there was substantial contact and believe something probably should have been called. When that happens, we are all responsible. And that does happen at every level. Sometimes we have no explanation just like players miss wide-open layins. It's OK to admit it.

I don't like to say "he had a better angle/look" or "you'll have to ask him", because on substantial contact, WE need to have some whistle. I feel that those kinds of remarks can be construed as "he missed it and I'm not getting involved". I'd rather remain completely silent on those occasions than go there. I don't feel comfortable with that; it feels like a U2 move. But I do understand that many do this, and I have no issue with it. It's not wrong.

You can make the argument that the coach will then go after the guy. My experience has been that when I make a statement like that, it ends there, because the coach knows he was heard, and it is acknowledged that WE just didn't have a whistle. Cannot do it more than once or twice in a game, but if more than that is missed, you just have to be aggressive out of your area and take care of business, or go silent.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Remember, I'd only use that IF there was substantial contact and believe something probably should have been called.

And how would you know if that happened out of your area?

[26 Year Gap]

Old School philosophy.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

And how would you know if that happened out of your area?

Come on, Mark. You officiate in your primary, but when you have to help get something outside of your primary, you do so. I can tell you every time there is a big collision or substantial contact during a game, because that can escalate and cause problems. And if I don't have a whistle, and nobody else does, I can freely admit to someone that there was a big collision and for whatever reason we didn't get anything. It happens. However, I love it when my partners pick up something that I should have, but just did not pull the trigger. That's teamwork and good for everyone.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Everyone has their own style. Remember, I'd only use that IF there was substantial contact and believe something probably should have been called. When that happens, we are all responsible. And that does happen at every level. Sometimes we have no explanation just like players miss wide-open layins. It's OK to admit it.

I don't like to say "he had a better angle/look" or "you'll have to ask him", because on substantial contact, WE need to have some whistle. I feel that those kinds of remarks can be construed as "he missed it and I'm not getting involved". I'd rather remain completely silent on those occasions than go there. I don't feel comfortable with that; it feels like a U2 move. But I do understand that many do this, and I have no issue with it. It's not wrong.

You can make the argument that the coach will then go after the guy. My experience has been that when I make a statement like that, it ends there, because the coach knows he was heard, and it is acknowledged that WE just didn't have a whistle. Cannot do it more than once or twice in a game, but if more than that is missed, you just have to be aggressive out of your area and take care of business, or go silent.

Sounds more like a U99 philosophy to me. Let me ask you this, oh Oracle-ish one...who is watching the players in your area while you and the coach are watching the ball in your parnter's area?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

I don't like to say "he had a better angle/look" or "you'll have to ask him", because on substantial contact, WE need to have some whistle.

Ever heard of incidental contact? Ever thought that your partner might have heard of incidental contact?

Substantial contact does not necessarily mean that a foul has occurred.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Ever heard of incidental contact? Ever thought that your partner might have heard of incidental contact?

Substantial contact does not necessarily mean that a foul has occurred.

But Jurassic, if you want to be an R, you need to pay attention to contact all over the court and make sure you let the coach know your partner missed calls. It makes the coaches like you more.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Ever heard of incidental contact? Ever thought that your partner might have heard of incidental contact?

Substantial contact does not necessarily mean that a foul has occurred.

Go back and actually read. Take a breath. Incidental contact? Yup, go back and read my original post. I'll never leave my area on incidental contact. "Yes, there was contact. We just did not have a whistle on that one." Pretty straight forward.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

I don't feel comfortable with that; it feels like a U2 move.

Yeah, because my assignor really likes his Rs to ball-watch and throw partners under the bus.

That's what is holding me back...

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

If you thought there was a foul: "You have a valid point, coach, I should have helped and didn't. My bad." "Hey, we just didn't get that one, myself included, and we heard you."

Helluva idea. "Yes, coach, my partner surely did screw up." Yup, helluva idea.

Lah me.

[Karin]

I agree that admitting to your own mistakes is ok"my bad""sorry was watching off ball" or what ever but as a team don't we need to back each other on the floor?
If not my primary area and I didn't get a good look I will leave to my partners judgement -thats not to say that a-at the next stoppage I wouldn't ask what happened or b-if it was a foul that the whole stadium not just the coach saw then I would be possibly looking at a "help out" call.We still have a responsibility to the game and players to ensure good outcomes.

As an evaluator I will drop marks for calls out of area or that came from ball watching but give praise for help outs that managed the game and helped the officiating team