Penalty for unauthorized leaving floor

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

What's the point of your questions? You're asking questions that you know the answers to and that (I'm pretty sure) we agree on. So what's really bugging you?

The point is that you are grossly inconsistent. You are penalizing players for stepping on certain lines on the court, but not on others.

You are letting a player score a point while touching one line, but not letting him score a point while touching another. Where is the sense in that?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Where is the sense in that?

One is a big deal and the other is not. :shrug:

Are you saying that you would wave off the free throw in a varsity game because the shooter's toe touched the line? Are you honestly saying that?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

One is a big deal and the other is not. :shrug:

Are you saying that you would wave off the free throw in a varsity game because the shooter's toe touched the line? Are you honestly saying that?

I'm not Nevada, but I both would and have waved off a free throw in a varsity game for violating the FT line. And I've never had an arguement or gotten a call later about it. The fact that it's varsity basketball makes me that much more certain that touching the line is unacceptable. All the players know the rule and should know how to shoot a FT w/o touching the line.

I actually agree with a number of your points, Scrapper, but lines are lines, and enforce them everywhere, including the FT line.

[chartrusepengui]

been there done that - especially at varsity contest where they should really know better. Maybe we should let varsity players take 4 steps on a drive to the basket too - that makes about as much sense as saying this violation is no big deal. When the HC questions you as to why you allowed a point to score on a clear violation on the FT - are you going to tell him because it's no big deal. His team down by 2 with 6 seconds left brings ball upcourt and unleashes an attempt but the toe touches the line the same way it did with the FT and you call 2 points. Better run for your life - why not flip a coin to determine what rules are important enough to call on any given night?

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

One is a big deal and the other is not. :shrug:

Are you saying that you would wave off the free throw in a varsity game because the shooter's toe touched the line? Are you honestly saying that?

I just measured...there is 1.125 inches from the end of my big toe to the outside edge of my shoe.



How 'bout this one?

A is down by 1, 10 seconds remaining in the game after a made FG by B and subsequint Time out.

A1 and A2 are now in the backcourt, all team B is at other end of court, no backcourt pressure.

A2 is standing at the FT line in BC and A1 inbounds the ball by rolling it on the floor to save time (so the clock won't start). But, the ball touches OOB by a good foot or so on the "bowling ball style" inbounds pass. Big deal?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by CoachP

How 'bout this one?

A is down by 1, 10 seconds remaining in the game after a made FG by B and subsequint Time out.

A1 and A2 are now in the backcourt, all team B is at other end of court, no backcourt pressure.

A2 is standing at the FT line in BC and A1 inbounds the ball by rolling it on the floor to save time (so the clock won't start). But, the ball touches OOB by a good foot or so on the "bowling ball style" inbounds pass. Big deal?

This exact play - a throw-in violation to conserve time - caused a lot of discussion locally about 5-6 years ago during a high school final!

The calling official on the game called the violation. I would have too.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Are you saying that you would wave off the free throw in a varsity game because the shooter's toe touched the line? Are you honestly saying that?

Oh, Nevaaaaadaaaaaaa. . . .

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

One is a big deal and the other is not. :shrug:

Are you saying that you would wave off the free throw in a varsity game because the shooter's toe touched the line? Are you honestly saying that?

I believe in making calls that can be validated on video. If the player has a foot on the FT line, they have violated.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I believe in making calls that can be validated on video. If the player has a foot on the FT line, they have violated.

And if the video shows a player in the lane for 3 seconds, while the ball is outside, that's a violation too, I take it? Or if the video shows a free thrower taking more than 10 seconds?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

And if the video shows a player in the lane for 3 seconds, while the ball is outside, that's a violation too, I take it? Or if the video shows a free thrower taking more than 10 seconds?

Yeah, JR, I do my best to properly penalize those as well.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Yeah, JR, I do my best to properly penalize those as well.

Calls 3 seconds every time an offensive player is illegally in the lane ...Got it.

Calls a violation on a FT shooter as soon as the count hits 11 seconds.....Got it.

Every single time! Got it.

OK. Thanks for the clarification.

[chartrusepengui]

I think I'm more concerned with, "Is it a career interrupter?"

If you are talking about an assignor not getting you games because you called a violation when toe was on FT line as being a career interrupter - you have a serious delima.

Should you officiate with integrity - or officiate to please an assignor? The problem in our area is that the school's AD is sometimes the assignor. In other districts - they have conference commissioners which are basically assignors - and in two districts where I work they are staff members of a school. I can't worry about what they want - I have to call what I see regardless of the result or I seriously lack in integrity. Some calls require more judgement - but stepping on a line is pretty obvious and you can't intentionally kick a call like that and still maintain your integrity. I think in the end the assignors with integrity will think more highly of you as an official if you make these calls instead of looking the other way. You need to be consistent. Just my opinion.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I believe in making calls that can be validated on video. If the player has a foot on the FT line, they have violated.

So do I, believe me. No camera from the top of the bleachers is going to see a TOE on the free throw line. We've never been talking about the foot stepping across the line. Just the toe, as he gets the ball above his head.

No way are you calling that in a varsity game or above. I just don't believe it.

For the record, if he steps with his foot on or over the line, I'll call that too. But I'm not calling one toe on the line and I honestly can't believe that you would either.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I believe in making calls that can be validated on video. If the player has a foot on the FT line, they have violated.

So if the game's not being taped you'll pass on this?