Young coaches attitudes today.

[Jway44]

As an experienced Varsity official, I still love the game at all levels, and very often work JV and middle school contests on days that I don't have a varsity assignment. I am amazed at the behavior of some of the "new" breed of middle school coaches coming into the game.

Case in point: last night only 2 minutes into the first quarter, the visiting coach, as the ball is being continuously shot and missed at his basket, leaps up off of the bench screaming "Give me a foul, give me a foul!!!!" Upon hearing this and then turning to see his animations on the side lines, I turned to the table, blew the whistle, and then as if calling any other foul, issued a technical foul to the head coach. He then responds with, "Why did I get a technical foul?" I said, very politely, "Coach, you said to give you a foul, and that is the only way that I know how." He in turn says, " I didn't want a foul on me, I wanted it on the other team." I explained to him that he should try his best at all times to refrain from officiating, and coach his team. He didn't like it, but was in good spirits the rest of the game, as he was glued to his seat due to losing his coaching box as a result of the T.

I have noticed this kind of behavior is becoming the norm at the MS level. We rarely have an issue in Varsity, but it seems to be a regular occurence at the JV and MS levels. I would assume that it is new coaches trying to see how far they can push, or the fact that they probably think that because you are working a lower level game, that maybe you are a newer official. I have been calling this game for 18 years, and pride myself in being fair to all coaches, and always trying to see their side of a situation before any technical fouls are assessed, but to me, I see this new breed of coaches getting out of hand. Any thoughts?

[Back In The Saddle]

This is how "new breed" coaches become varsity coach material...by messing up and having competent officials tag them for it. Congrats on helping that coach realize the error of his ways.

[imagomer]

They are (I was) ignorant. Your demanding proper behavior should reduce the ignorance, if he/they are willing to learn. I have found few venues which teach/encourage/demand proper behavior, so, right or wrong, coaches will do whatever you allow them to do.

[Bearfanmike20]

One of my mentors gave me this quote and I will use it.

"Coach, I cant shoot the baskets, you cant call the fouls."

[TheOracle]

Coaches have been the same. I guess I am the weird one who rarely sees improper behavior, but as an experienced official it is relatively easy to counsel the lower-level coaches on seeing things from your point of view, and how they can ask questions/make points without alienating the officials. Your example is humorous; some coaches might not find the humor in it.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Coaches have been the same. I guess I am the weird one who rarely sees improper behavior, but as an experienced official it is relatively easy to counsel the lower-level coaches on seeing things from your point of view, and how they can ask questions/make points without alienating the officials. Your example is humorous; some coaches might not find the humor in it.

I call Bull****! Utter, complete, and unrelenting bull****. I don't know where you dream this crap up, but a television show based on your officiating experience would very clearly not be listed under "Reality TV."

Hey guys! I think we found who pilferred Mark's meds.

[Mark Padgett]

I probably see as many MS coaches as anyone here, and I can tell you I think there has been a deterioration of professionalism and behavior over the past few years. Of course, this is a broad (Juulie - I don't mean it that way) generalization. There are still many who act professionally and don't cause problems, but not as many percentage-wise as in the past, in my opinion.

The only reason I can come up with for this is perhaps there is a higher level of success expected by upper level coaches for whom these MS programs act as feeders, and by parents, than in the past. As I'm sure we all agree, parents equate yelling and screaming coaches with effective coaches. Plus, they may also be trying to deflect blame for lack of success so the perception by "higher-ups" is that they aren't as bad as they really are, when being considered for promotion.

Or, maybe our society is just producing more jerks who want to coach. Yeah, that's it.

[TheOracle]

People skills, people skills, people skills. Some use the carrot, some use the stick. Both work.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

People skills, people skills, people skills. Some use the carrot, some use the stick. Both work.

Yep. And we all know what makes carrots grow nice and big.

[Back In The Saddle]

Dang! I think I just broke my solemn vow to never reply to Old Stool.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

Yep. And we all know what makes carrots grow nice and big.

It's worth breaking your vow for. Funny!!

[riden]

Originally Posted by Jway44

As an experienced Varsity official, I still love the game at all levels, and very often work JV and middle school contests on days that I don't have a varsity assignment. I am amazed at the behavior of some of the "new" breed of middle school coaches coming into the game.

Case in point: last night only 2 minutes into the first quarter, the visiting coach, as the ball is being continuously shot and missed at his basket, leaps up off of the bench screaming "Give me a foul, give me a foul!!!!" Upon hearing this and then turning to see his animations on the side lines, I turned to the table, blew the whistle, and then as if calling any other foul, issued a technical foul to the head coach. He then responds with, "Why did I get a technical foul?" I said, very politely, "Coach, you said to give you a foul, and that is the only way that I know how." He in turn says, " I didn't want a foul on me, I wanted it on the other team." I explained to him that he should try his best at all times to refrain from officiating, and coach his team. He didn't like it, but was in good spirits the rest of the game, as he was glued to his seat due to losing his coaching box as a result of the T.
I have noticed this kind of behavior is becoming the norm at the MS level. We rarely have an issue in Varsity, but it seems to be a regular occurence at the JV and MS levels. I would assume that it is new coaches trying to see how far they can push, or the fact that they probably think that because you are working a lower level game, that maybe you are a newer official. I have been calling this game for 18 years, and pride myself in being fair to all coaches, and always trying to see their side of a situation before any technical fouls are assessed, but to me, I see this new breed of coaches getting out of hand. Any thoughts?

New rule to me, can you please explain it?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by riden

New rule to me, can you please explain it?

Not a new rule. In states that recognize the coaching box, when a coach gets a technical foul (direct or indirect) he loses the right to use the box.

[reddevil19]

I can't disagree with the opening post, unfortunately. In the last 2-3 years (in which I've not been coaching, but have stayed around the game in various roles), as more and more schools have opened and/or added more subvarsity teams, there has been a noticeable decline in the age and personal/professional skills of the new coaches. In my area, there's a mandated ethics course that all coaches have to take, but it doesn't really do much.

When I started coaching 10 years ago, I was a "coach of last resort" for my brother's 9th grade team. I was 18, and knew very little about what I was doing, so I kept a low-profile and hoped nobody would notice my ignorance . Of course, it was easy with the games because we played on Saturdays and the games were worked by varsity officials looking for pocket money. About 3 years in, 9th grade ball was sanctioned and we started playing weekdays with less experienced subvarsity refs. This coincided with my thinking I had it all figured out and I had a brief Bobby Knight stage (without throwing things). Then, when it was my turn to ref our in-house 8th grade league, I found out that it really is difficult to see stuff off the ball sometimes and it is a whole different game out there on the court. Consider it my epiphany on how to be a more professional coach. From then on, I learned that you can't question everything, and that being an idiot is never going to get a call reversed.

[Y2Koach]

There is a lack of training for new coaches, especially at the lower levels. Especially with so many "leagues" at such a young age, and the lack of qualified coaches, anyone perceived as "knowing basketball" can get into coaching. Great former players do not make the best coaches as the game was probably very natural to them so they don't know how to teach those less naturally gifted. Also, coaches that are in it for themselves lose perspective about how the kids they coach emulate them.

I was fortunate to get my start coaching under my 8th grade basketball coach. He did not know his basketball X's and O's very well as he was a football coach/teacher by trade. He was always very intense and passionate, yet dignified and classy. When he coached me, any player that addressed the refs with anything other than calmly asking for an explanation for a call would be benched for the rest of the quarter. He was loud, strict, passionate, and a perfectionist during practice, but he rarely raised his voice during games unless one of us made the same mistake over and over. When he hired me as his 7th grade coach, all he needed to tell me was "I know you'll do a good job, just remember you are representing yourself, your school, and ME when you go out there."

During the first few games of the season, our teams played at the same time so he did not get to see me coach. I thought I was representing myself well (what did I know, I was only 18) but I guess I did not realize how much of a whiny coach I was, spending most of the game yelling at the refs and yelling at my players. Then there was a game where my coach got to see my team in action. At half time with my team winning by about 15, before I joined my team in the locker room, he pulled me aside and talked to me: (to paraphrase) "I hired you to coach these kids, not to yell at the officials. Yelling at them will not make these kids better players and your kids become how you are. Next time you get the urge to yell at the refs, think about what skills or drills you can put in next practice to take the refs out of that situation. and if the refs do miss calls, you gotta remember, its middle school ball with middle school refs. Do your job. Oh, and stop whining."