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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 08:44am
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In the NF rules, they say that only the captain of the team may ask for interpretations (there's nothing about Howler Monkeys).

They also say to use the captain to talk his buddies out of fouls.

How much do you use captains to help you officiate?

Have you ever told a howler monkey that a rule interpretation will only be given to the captain?
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 02:29pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by inkwiziter
In the NF rules, they say that only the captain of the team may ask for interpretations (there's nothing about Howler Monkeys).

They also say to use the captain to talk his buddies out of fouls.

How much do you use captains to help you officiate?

Have you ever told a howler monkey that a rule interpretation will only be given to the captain?
IMHO, the "captain" designation should be removed.

If a player is respectful, I'll answer the question, even if the player isn't a captain.

If a player isn't respectful, it doesn't matter if the player is a captain.
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 02:36pm
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I only use "captains" when the game is getting out of hand in some way. If I need to tell a captain about somethings that are happening overall in the game, like trash talking or other extraciricular activity that is not basketbal related, I might call the captains together and say something. But I do it so that all the players can hear me and leave it at that. But if if specific player is getting out of hand, who cares if he or she is the captain at that point, I will say what needs to be said to that player.

But for the most part, I agree with Bob. Come to me respectfully, I will always talk to you.

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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 03:37pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by bob jenkins

IMHO, the "captain" designation should be removed.

If a player is respectful, I'll answer the question, even if the player isn't a captain.

If a player isn't respectful, it doesn't matter if the player is a captain.
I agree.
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 03:46pm
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In one of my first college games the ref (D-1 tournament ref) told the captains at the pre-game captain's conference that we as a crew would try and come to the captains if we had a problem with one of their teammates and that we expected the captain to take care of the problem so we didn't have to. He then told the captains that they didn't get the same break as their teammates because their teams had designated them as captain. He closed with we would take care of business without any warnings if the situation warranted it but then we'd expect the captain to help out so an ejection wouldn't have to occur. The captains acknowledged this and I've incorporated it into my captain's conferences no matter what the level. I've found that most captains have lived up to their duties when I've need them to (i.e. "hey captain, #32 is close to costing you guys in a big way"). I then look to see if the captain talks to #32. If so, great. If not, oh well we do what we have to do. I've also had some captain's say to me "he's/she's always a problem so do what you have to do". Preventive officiating.
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 10:31pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by walter
In one of my first college games the ref (D-1 tournament ref) told the captains at the pre-game captain's conference that we as a crew would try and come to the captains if we had a problem with one of their teammates and that we expected the captain to take care of the problem so we didn't have to. He then told the captains that they didn't get the same break as their teammates because their teams had designated them as captain. He closed with we would take care of business without any warnings if the situation warranted it but then we'd expect the captain to help out so an ejection wouldn't have to occur. The captains acknowledged this and I've incorporated it into my captain's conferences no matter what the level. I've found that most captains have lived up to their duties when I've need them to (i.e. "hey captain, #32 is close to costing you guys in a big way"). I then look to see if the captain talks to #32. If so, great. If not, oh well we do what we have to do. I've also had some captain's say to me "he's/she's always a problem so do what you have to do". Preventive officiating.
Why does this need to be the speaking captain? Couldn't
you just go to any other player that seemed reasonably
bright? What if the speaking captain turns out to be a real
jerk? Then you're stuck, no?
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 10:51pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref

Why does this need to be the speaking captain? Couldn't
you just go to any other player that seemed reasonably
bright? What if the speaking captain turns out to be a real
jerk? Then you're stuck, no?
And, what if the "speaking captain" happened to not be in the game at that moment?
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Old Wed Jan 30, 2002, 11:01pm
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From 7th grade and above I tell the Captain of each team the following things:

1) They are in complete charge of their teams including teammates and all bench personnel (from their Head Coach to the last person on the bench, this includes all teammates, substitutes, coaches, managers, statisticicans, doctors, nurses, chiropractors, massuses, preists, nuns, rabbis, agents, psychics, etc.).

2) I am an old man with bad knees and ankles and if I, as the Lead, call a foul, report the foul, and then become the new Lead and have the ball and I am ready to administer the free throws, there had better be two non-shooters in the first blocks, and a shooter on the free throw line waiting for me, not me waiting for them.

I think that the real problem with the game today is that their too much coaching during dead ball situations. Everytime the whistle sounds, coaches think that they are allowed to have a mini-timeout, which delays the game. Officials sound their whistles, signal a foul or violation, report the what their call is, and then have to wait while a coach or both coaches have a mini-timeout with their team.

I tell coaches that until a team timeout is granted the players belong to the officials on the court. The officials on the court need the full attention of the players. If they have information that is so important that it impinges upon the ability of the officials to conduct the game in a timely manner, they should request at team timeout.

How many of us have stepped into the lane to administer free throws and the players are too busy giving instructions to each other that you wonder if the free throw hears you tell him/her how many free throws. At least twice a game one of the players in the low blocks will ask me how many free throws after the shooter has the ball, because they were talking to teammates or their coach when I was giving that information, I refuse to answer their question and tell them to ask their coach or teammate.

I am sorry, I just got off on a Dennis Miller rant.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 12:02am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
... At least twice a game one of the players in the low blocks will ask me how many free throws after the shooter has the ball, because they were talking to teammates or their coach when I was giving that information, I refuse to answer their question and tell them to ask their coach or teammate.

I am sorry, I just got off on a Dennis Miller rant.
Twice a game? Obviously a problem that needs to be worked
on.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 09:43am
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If the speaking captain is not in the game, I find either another player who was at the conference or a player out on the floor who appears to know what's going on. I've found that when you let players take care of their own whenever possible, problems often take care of themselves. If there are no such players on the floor, if I get the chance, I tell the coach that #_ _ is about to cost you, please take care of it or we will. This works more often than not in my experience.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 09:52am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
At least twice a game one of the players in the low blocks will ask me how many free throws after the shooter has the ball, because they were talking to teammates or their coach when I was giving that information, I refuse to answer their question and tell them to ask their coach or teammate.

Mark,

Is it just possible that you are not doing as good a job of communicating with the players as you think you are? Have they tuned you out because of your demeanor or attitude on the floor? Only you can honestly answer those questions, as we have not seen how you work on the floor?

A player asking again how many free throws deserves an answer if he was polite in his request. It does not take that much effort to raise the proper number of fingers for him. If you don't, all you have done is moved a step closer to alienating him from you, and you never know which player may be the one to stop a problem later in the game. What if you just lost the most important "lifeline" with the other players on the team.

Just points for you to consider the next time you look in the mirror to shave.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 10:11am
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Big,
Well stated!
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 04:42pm
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i know the rule, but if a player comes to me respectfully, I will listen to them.
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Old Thu Jan 31, 2002, 04:53pm
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I look at the captains as honors for them at the captains meeting. During the game I treat all players on the court with respect and talk to them the same as the captains.
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Old Sat Feb 02, 2002, 10:23am
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Quote:
Originally posted by bigwhistle
Quote:
Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
At least twice a game one of the players in the low blocks will ask me how many free throws after the shooter has the ball, because they were talking to teammates or their coach when I was giving that information, I refuse to answer their question and tell them to ask their coach or teammate.

Mark,

Is it just possible that you are not doing as good a job of communicating with the players as you think you are? Have they tuned you out because of your demeanor or attitude on the floor? Only you can honestly answer those questions, as we have not seen how you work on the floor?

A player asking again how many free throws deserves an answer if he was polite in his request. It does not take that much effort to raise the proper number of fingers for him. If you don't, all you have done is moved a step closer to alienating him from you, and you never know which player may be the one to stop a problem later in the game. What if you just lost the most important "lifeline" with the other players on the team.

Just points for you to consider the next time you look in the mirror to shave.

My H.S. coach, who won 378 games in 21 years, has made the same observation that I have, and that is that coaches do too much coaching. Everytime that the officials blow the whistle, the coaches think that this is time for them to have a mini-timeout with their team. Go to a jr. H.S. or H.S. game and observe what takes place during free throws. The players have to run over to their bench and get instructions from their coach, and then they go to the lane and start discussing what they are to do during the game. Many times they will not stop their talking to listen to the Lead official when he steps into the lane to announce the number of free throws. When I played I would have never of thought to ignore an official and his instructions. It is an official's job to wait until the players are done with their mini-timeout before stepping into the lane. We have a job to do, and one of the jobs of the players is to realize that when the Lead steps into the lane, it is his/her show. If a player chooses to not pay attention when his opponents are paying attention, why should the officials bail him/her out for not doing his/her job as a player.

I am a "bleeding heart liberal" but do not give me this horse manure about important "lifeline" with other players on the team or alienating that player. This is not different that the baseball/softball player who does not know how many outs there are in the inning. The number of outs in the inning dictates defensive and offensive strategy and if a player is not paying attention, he/she has to find her information from a teammate or coach. For the base umpire to tell him/her the number of outs is the same as coaching that player.

Lets start expecting some respect from players when we as the Lead step into the lane to administer free throws at the H.S. level and below. If our boss (wives) we giving us instructions we sure would not carry on a conversation at the same time with a co-worker.
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