Egregious mis-application of a rule

[justacoach]

Here's the sitch...

HS Varsity game. Fed rules in effect.

OOB throw-in at division line. Thrower retreats straight backwards into open floor space to gain passing angle and avoid defensive pressure. Administering official hits whistle and signals with Travel mechanic.

What recourse does the head coach have to avoid an unwarranted loss of possession?

My first inclination is to request a time out and ask to confer with the officiating team.

What would you folks suggest as the proper protocol to follow?

What are the chances of getting a rectification?

TIA for all relevant replies, rules citations not needed, just looking for advice as to if or how to proceed.

[Nevadaref]

You would have to politely ask the official if he is sure that is the right call. You may even be able to ask if he would consider checking with his partner for some help. This is not a correctable error. This is simply a misapplication of the rules. If you lose out on a possession over this, it isn't the end of the world, but it isn't good either.
You should make sure not to take a technical foul over this. That would only hurt your team more.

I would contact whoever is in charge of your area officials and make my comments. If the official doesn't understand this fundamental, there are probably many other things that also need work.

[Jurassic Referee]

What Nevada said.

It's probably not worth wasting a TO either, unless you have one that you don't really need. Ask him sometime though if you get a chance. In cases like these, coaches can help us too. Maybe he might think about it and look it up after the game.

[Scrapper1]

"I'm sorry, ref, but it was my understanding that dribbling and traveling rules aren't in effect during a throw-in. What's the rule on that?"

[Coltdoggs]

Isn't the space for throw in allotted a 3' wide (as long as keeping one foot in the 3' wide area) and as deep as one would like....They don't have to be right up on the side or end line on spot throw in. I'm probably not gonna alllow them to go up in the stands obviously...but if it's an area that has 8' behind it, can't they back up....

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Coltdoggs

Isn't the space for throw in allotted a 3' wide (as long as keeping one foot in the 3' wide area) and as deep as one would like....They don't have to be right up on the side or end line on spot throw in. I'm probably not gonna alllow them to go up in the stands obviously...but if it's an area that has 8' behind it, can't they back up....

i usually remind them that they can go back as far as they want if they have pressure (especially at the lower levels)...a lot of times you get a look like they have no idea what you are talking about and end up standing belly to belly with the defender anyway...i wish more coaches would teach this, glad to see that some are....doesn't really help if the officials screw it up i guess!

Originally Posted by justacoach

Here's the sitch...

HS Varsity game. Fed rules in effect.

OOB throw-in at division line. Thrower retreats straight backwards into open floor space to gain passing angle and avoid defensive pressure. Administering official hits whistle and signals with Travel mechanic.

What recourse does the head coach have to avoid an unwarranted loss of possession?

My first inclination is to request a time out and ask to confer with the officiating team.

What would you folks suggest as the proper protocol to follow?

What are the chances of getting a rectification?

TIA for all relevant replies, rules citations not needed, just looking for advice as to if or how to proceed.

I find it amazing a varsity level official did this. At the first timeout I would politely ask all three of them to come over and ASK them why it was called. Don't TELL them they were wrong. If he says, "He stepped outside the 3-foot area with both feet" then you have no issue, but you might want to remind them there is no traveling on an inbounds. If he says he moved backwards, then ask his partners if they agree. In the unlikely event they ALL think it's a violation, I would explain that it's not. Then thank them.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

I find it amazing a varsity level official did this. At the first timeout I would politely ask all three of them to come over and ASK them why it was called. Don't TELL them they were wrong. If he says, "He stepped outside the 3-foot area with both feet" then you have no issue, but you might want to remind them there is no traveling on an inbounds. If he says he moved backwards, then ask his partners if they agree. In the unlikely event they ALL think it's a violation, I would explain that it's not. Then thank them.

If they said he moved backwards, this would still not be a violation as there's no depth limitation (4-42-6).

Not sure if that's what you're saying...

[Bearfanmike20]

go bobby knight on them....

LOL JK

I would suggest as others to politly say your peice and leave it at that.

Originally Posted by tjones1

If they said he moved backwards, this would still not be a violation as there's no depth limitation (4-42-6).

Not sure if that's what you're saying...

I agree, it's not a violation. My point was that if the calling official says the player moved backwards and that is why he called the violation, I would let his partners correct him right there by asking them if they agree that is NOT a violation. Don't TELL the official he was wrong, just let him step in it himself.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

I agree, it's not a violation. My point was that if the calling official says the player moved backwards and that is why he called the violation, I would let his partners correct him right there by asking them if they agree that is NOT a violation. Don't TELL the official he was wrong, just let him step in it himself.

Got ya.. just making sure.

[jer166]

This is something I would take up with the assignor after the game.

One of the problems here is that, once again, most coaches don't know the rules either so there is usually no challenge. Maybe his partners brought it up in their post game. Unless the game is on the line, most officials are not going to throw their partner under the bus during a game & some not even then.

I'm curious about the coach's response in your situation.

[dblref]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

I find it amazing a varsity level official did this. At the first timeout I would politely ask all three of them to come over and ASK them why it was called. Don't TELL them they were wrong. If he says, "He stepped outside the 3-foot area with both feet" then you have no issue, but you might want to remind them there is no traveling on an inbounds. If he says he moved backwards, then ask his partners if they agree. In the unlikely event they ALL think it's a violation, I would explain that it's not. Then thank them.

This might not be a varsity official. Since the OP is located in northern VA, this game would have to be either a rec league or possibly a scrimmage of some type, and the official(s) might be sub-varsity. Happens all the time during scrimmages. The scholastic season doesn't start here until late Nov (don't know the exact date).

[SMEngmann]

If I'm the coach, and it's a critical point in the game, I call timeout and ask the calling official what he called. Most likely, the calling official will quote the proper rule and the infraction simply wasn't seen by the coach. If the official doesn't know the rule, ask for a conference with his partner(s). If they determine that an error had been made, they MIGHT give you the ball back and if you're really lucky, they might not charge the timeout.

If this situation happened in my game, I would use my elastic power to overturn the call and give the team the ball back, and I would most likely ask the coach if he still wanted the TO. I would then bring the coaches together, explain the situation and resume play. In my opinion, we have an obligation to get plays right and be fair, it is a cop out when a situation is fixable to say, "Sorry coach, we screwed up, but we're going with it anyhow." Common sense is key here.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by SMEngmann

If this situation happened in my game, I would use my elastic power to overturn the call and give the team the ball back, and I would most likely ask the coach if he still wanted the TO.

What elastic power?

Have you got a rules citation that overrules the language of rule 2-6?

You can tell the calling official that he screwed up. You can ask him to change his call. If he doesn't want to change it though, no one has any elastic powers to make him do so, including the R.

I agree that you should try your best (away from everybody but the officials) to get your partner to change his (wrong) call, but if he doesn't want to, then we just suffer.