Pistol,
I can live with not making a deal of it.
But I will not tell anyone that the voluntary release was a fumble, because then the player can pass to themselves and never have to dribble.
mick

Mick
I AGREE!!!!
Pistol

RecRef, it isn't traveling. Even if she contacted the floor, as long as she didn't pick the ball up before she stood, it still wouldn't be traveling.

Putting the ball on the floor is no more a pass than it is a dribble. I don't find a rule prohibiting it.

Ah no, she didn't. This rule applies to a player who gains control of the ball while kneeling, sitting or lying on the floor.

As Padgett, if a player puts the ball on the floor, kneels and ties her shoe, stands, and then picks up the ball, she has not traveled.

"Set the ball on the floor"--that is what the post reads. This means she put both hands on the ball ("I"m sure she didn't palm it"). Therefore her dribble had ended. So, if and when she released the ball (set the ball down on the floor), can she pick it back up without it being a double dribble ????

Yes, in 4.43.5 Situations B, the player sets the ball down, gets up, picks the ball up and is called for traveling.

If setting the ball down was a dribble, then you wouldn't have a travel in 4.43.5 Situations B.

APHP, yes, she can. Touching the ball to the floor does not constitute a dribble. 4-15-4 Note 3

This is not the same situation ase 4.43.5 B. in the case play, the player gained control of the ball while on the floor. He placed the ball on the floor, got up, and picked the ball up then to circumvent the rule.

You are right, it isn't a dribble or a pass; it is equivalent to tossing the ball in the air while standing. If a player moves there pivot while doing that, then they have traveled.

I guess we'll have to disagree. This isn't a pass. As Padgett stated earlier, this is no different than an interrupted dribble.

Sorry to disagree: I'm afraid it is completely different from an interrupted dribble; an interrupted dribble is an accidental loss of control. You are allowed to move your feet during an interrupted dribble, you can't move your feet in this situation without traveling.

You're misapplying the Case Book play but that's okay. The point is that there's no player control during either. Player control exists when a player is holding or dribbling a ball. In this case, she is doing neither.

Is there player control while I stand and repeatedly bounce a ball upwards from my hand, i.e., during the time the ball is in the air?

Yes, this player still has player control. He may be tossing it into the air but, for control purposes, he essentially is still holding it.

But a player who puts the ball on the floor and ties her shoe, whether her knee touches the floor or not, does not have player control.

[Edited by BktBallRef on Jan 27th, 2002 at 08:47 PM]

But you said that there is only player control while holding and while dribbling; please explain why there is player control while tossing.

Slider,
yup...nope...yup...nope...yup...nope...yup...nope. ...
mick

I'll let you study Rule 4 and make up your own mind.