Yet another travelling question...and another!

[rainmaker]

Part 1: I thought if the dribbler picked up his dribble and then an opponent swatted the ball, the dribbler could then have another dribble. (What a tongue twister!!) Am I mistaken?

(To quote Click and Clack)
Part B: I thought if the ball was in the process of being "held", that is if one player from each team has some sort of control, that those players could move their feet, without it being a travel. Am I wrong?

[Slider]

I love Click and Clack, but I don't get your allusion.

Anyway, if the player swats the ball hard enough that a plyer holding it loses control, then that "dribbler" could dribble again.

If two players both have control, then they may move their feet per the limits of the normal traveling provisions; if either of them violates, make the call.

[crew]

Originally posted by rainmaker

(To quote Click and Clack)
Part B: I thought if the ball was in the process of being "held", that is if one player from each team has some sort of control, that those players could move their feet, without it being a travel. Am I wrong?

if 1 player from both teams have "some sort of control" and one of the 2 move both their feet, wouldnt this cause a held ball situation. i would call jumpball.

[Dan_ref]

My favorite click & clack credit:

Limousine service provided by Pikop Andropoff

Anyway, on the held ball travel, I don't think I've ever
called one but by the book you could have a travel while
2 players are still tussling for the ball. Frankly at this
point I'm more focussed on the ball and who's
hands/arms/elbows go where than with feet moving.

[w_sohl]

On the held ball sitch, I would call a jump because it is likely that because the ball is held that something that the other player did (jerked the ball or pulled/pushed it) caused the other player to move both feet. I don't think you would get to much of ann arguement from the coaches if you went that direction either.

[BktBallRef]

Please don't call traveling during a held ball.
If it's a held ball, it'a a held ball.
If it's held, blow the whistle.

Even so, neither team has team control.
If there's no team control, there can't possibly be player control.
No player control, no traveling.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Please don't call traveling during a held ball.
If it's a held ball, it'a a held ball.
If it's held, blow the whistle.

Even so, neither team has team control.
If there's no team control, there can't possibly be player control.
No player control, no traveling.

I disagree in theory, agree in practice.

A1 has possession. B1 grabs the ball. In an effort to
pull the ball away from B1, and before the official has a
held ball, A1 moves his pivot foot while maintaining
possession. A1 has travelled, regardless of what B1 is
doing.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Slider
I love Click and Clack, but I don't get your allusion.

The allusion is the the way they call things Part 1, and then Part B.

Tony, thanks for the rule discussion about held-ball/travel. I always will call a held ball, but in the last week, I've seen several refs call a travel if one of the girls moves her feet. That's why I was asking.

Now, Tony, what about Part 1?

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by rainmaker

The allusion is the the way they call things Part 1, and then Part B.

That's great! I can't believe I didn't figure it out myself!!

[Slider]

Sorry, rainmaker, I had Cases on my brain; there are cases where two players from the same team have control, and then you can have a travel if one of them moves a pivot foot.

I agree with the others that you can never have opponents in control of the same ball, unless you have a held ball.

However, if only one them is in control, that one could violate.

Thanks for clearing up the allusion, I had noticed that

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Dan_ref


I disagree in theory, agree in practice.

A1 has possession. B1 grabs the ball. In an effort to
pull the ball away from B1, and before the official has a
held ball, A1 moves his pivot foot while maintaining
possession. A1 has travelled, regardless of what B1 is
doing.

My point is that we can't have both. You either have a held ball prior to A1 moving his pivot or you have traveling, A1 moving his pivot, prior to the held ball. But we can't have traveling while two opponents are holding the ball.

Juulie, in play #1, if there's enough contact to knock the ball loose, then A1 can dribble again. If he just allows the ball to come loose, then it's simply a fumble on his part and all he can do is retrieve it.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

My point is that we can't have both. You either have a held ball prior to A1 moving his pivot or you have traveling, A1 moving his pivot, prior to the held ball. But we can't have traveling while two opponents are holding the ball.

I think we're saying the same thing.

[mick]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Juulie, in play #1, if there's enough contact to knock the ball loose, then A1 can dribble again. If he just allows the ball to come loose, then it's simply a fumble on his part and all he can do is retrieve it.

Yeah, and so many times a ballhandler may feel the defender lightly touch the ball, and then he may just willingly drop it and attempt to re-dribble.
mick

[Peter Devana]

Rain maker re-read, Bsktbalref's answer . He is correct!
Pistol