Throw In Violation?

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Wrong.

This is because under both rules sets travel rules are not in effect during throw-ins, ever.

Just a suggestion I would leave the term traveling out of any explaination regarding a throw-in.
There is no such thing as Traveling on a throw-in!

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

Just a suggestion I would leave the term traveling out of any explaination regarding a throw-in.
There is no such thing as Traveling on a throw-in!

You broke your own rule, but thanks anyway.

[OHBBREF]

I agree you can Fumble the ball and go get it and pass it in bounds - however it can not be a pass.

JR you even say in your first response call it a Fumble an move on - so if you for some reason define it as a pass it has to be illegal,

I am not saying that you can enter the court and come back out of bounds either (I didn't intend that anyway) but Mark said the only reason was because of the reentry out of bounds and clearly the rule book says that is not the case.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

I agree you can Fumble the ball and go get it and pass it in bounds - however it can not be a pass.

Hmmm...

There's a case where A1 throws the ball in the direction of a teammate. the teammate isn't looking and moves away. A1 moves and recovers the ball after it hits the floor. The ruling is that this is a dribble.

Why wouldn't the same concept apply on the OP (except we couldn't call it a dribble, of course)?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Hmmm...

There's a case where A1 throws the ball in the direction of a teammate. the teammate isn't looking and moves away. A1 moves and recovers the ball after it hits the floor. The ruling is that this is a dribble.

Why wouldn't the same concept apply on the OP (except we couldn't call it a dribble, of course)?

Of course this is never a pass because as I mentioned a pass is defined as moving the ball from 1 player to another. No such thing as a "self pass", no such thing as a travel or dribble violation during a throw-in, it's all perfectly legal unless you violate by coming inbounds & stepping back out with or without the ball. The AR under discussion covers the second of these 2 cases.

There's really no need to bring in other rules, it's all self consistent IMO.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

... it's all self consistent IMO.

It's not even consistent with the NCAA rules. That is the point JR is making.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Then I can assume that it is safe to say that anybody who really has a good knowledge of the NFHS and NCAA rules realizes that A.R. 155 is poorly worded and only applies to the part where A1 steps inbounds. AND that is not a violation for A1 to release the ball along the endline on the out of bounds side of the endline and recover it before it touches a teammate out of bounds along the endline.

MTD, Sr.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

It's not even consistent with the NCAA rules. That is the point JR is making.

JR? Two points on JR:

1. Screw him

2. He's referencing NFHS rules, not NCAA rules

oh yeah, a third point

3. Screw him

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

JR you even say in your first response call it a Fumble an move on - so if you for some reason define it as a pass it has to be illegal,

Can you cite an NCAA or NFHS rule that states that's it's illegal to pass the ball along the end-line on an unrestricted throw-in and then go get it before a teammate touches it?

I can't.

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Can you cite an NCAA or NFHS rule that states that's it's illegal to pass the ball along the end-line on an unrestricted throw-in and then go get it before a teammate touches it?

Actually I can not either.

All I can do is use the AR 155 which says that it is illegal and give reasons why.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Can you cite an NCAA or NFHS rule that states that's it's illegal to pass the ball along the end-line on an unrestricted throw-in and then go get it before a teammate touches it?

I can't.

Nope, and that is why I'm with you that this play should be legal in both NFHS and NCAA play, but someone made a poor decision to write an A.R. making it illegal in an NCAA game. That is the only reason that I can state that it is currently a violation in NCAA play.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

Just a suggestion I would leave the term traveling out of any explanation regarding a throw-in.

Does that mean that the NFHS rulesmakers should delete case book play 7.6.2COMMENT? That NFHS case play says exactly what you are saying shouldn't be said.

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Does that mean that the NFHS rulesmakers should delete case book play 7.6.2COMMENT? That NFHS case play says exactly what you are saying shouldn't be said.

They may want to consider doing so since no where in the definition of traveling is there any reference to a Throw-in -
While I do not have the rule or case book with me - I do not recall ever seeing traveling refered to in Rule 7 either. I may be wrong there - but the violation is leaving the spot - not traveling as it used to be.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by OHBBREF

They may want to consider doing so since no where in the definition of traveling is there any reference to a Throw-in -
While I do not have the rule or case book with me - I do not recall ever seeing traveling refered to in Rule 7 either. I may be wrong there - but the violation is leaving the spot - not traveling as it used to be.

You are wrong. Look in the "Throw-In" section, to find the "traveling" reference, not vice-versa. NFHS case book play 7.6.2COMMENT says "Pivot-foot restrictions and the TRAVELING rule are NOT in effect for a THROW-IN".

Your statement was "Just a suggestion I would leave the term traveling out of any any explanation regarding the throw-in".

The NFHS rulesmakers very, very obviously completely disagree with your suggestion above. The NFHS rulesmakers included the term "traveling" in THEIR explanation regarding the throw-on(their explanation being case book play 7.6.2COMMENT).

[OHBBREF]

JR
I refer to the Rule Book RULE 7 not the case book comment as far as refererence to traveling being in the RULE -
True - The traveling rule is not in effect - that IMHO references the fact that a player can still move both feet within the area during designated spot throw in without being subject to the same restrictions when they are in possession of the ball while on the playing floor.
The rule itself specifically states that you can run the end line after a basket without penalty so it would be redunundant at that point.
I will conceed the point son removing the word traveling from the Comment sice I did actually see a first year guy make that call early in the year.