ncaa traveling

[just another ref]

I am not a college ref, never have been, probably never will be, so somebody enlighten me. Is the ncaa travel rule the same, or anywhere near the same, as nfhs? I have seen more plays in the tournament this year that make me spontaneously point (travel! that's a travel) than ever before. It seem that d1 is catching up to what is allowed in the nba. Or is that just my take?

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by just another ref

I am not a college ref, never have been, probably never will be, so somebody enlighten me. Is the ncaa travel rule the same, or anywhere near the same, as nfhs? I have seen more plays in the tournament this year that make me spontaneously point (travel! that's a travel) than ever before. It seem that d1 is catching up to what is allowed in the nba. Or is that just my take?

Traveling is the same as NFHS. The athletes are more talented now and are getting away with it. Things happen so fast on the court it can be hard to call sometimes. It wouldn't surprise me if Mr. Nichols makes a point of emphasis next season.

[caliref]

I think it might be worse in NCAA now than in the NBA. Have not been impressed with some of the things I have seen.

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by caliref

I think it might be worse in NCAA now than in the NBA.

For that to happen, the NCAA would have to give up on dribbling altogether.

[JRutledge]

The hyperbole on this site just amazes me sometimes. I cannot believe what people actually come up with. For one I can watch any HS game in America and see many travels missed or not called consistently. Throughout the game of basketball the traveling rule is the most inconsistently called out there.

I watch HS games on Fox TV and see many travels called that could not be travels all the time. So I think it balances out if you ask me.

Peace

[Scrapper1]

I have to agree with JRutledge. I watched a lot of basketball yesterday and noticed only 2 blatant travels that were not called. Both of them were at the start of the dribble.

I don't think it's an epidemic as the original poster seems to indicate. But I do think that traveling is the toughest call in basketball.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

I have to agree with JRutledge. I watched a lot of basketball yesterday and noticed only 2 blatant travels that were not called. Both of them were at the start of the dribble.

I don't think it's an epidemic as the original poster seems to indicate. But I do think that traveling is the toughest call in basketball.

You and Jeff may be right that it's the toughest call, but it seems pretty obvious that a lot of refs lean toward leniency rather than strictness. I disagree that the only blatant travels yesterday were at the beginning of the dribble. I saw at least two that were on clear breaks to the basket. No question about allowing an extra step or two after the ball was clearly gathered.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

You and Jeff may be right that it's the toughest call, but it seems pretty obvious that a lot of refs lean toward leniency rather than strictness.

Or they don't knick-pick the game. Get the obvious, be consistent. I certainly don't want my playoff game to turn into a bunch of travel calls, especially marginal travel calls. Next thing you know the coaches and everyone else starts screaming for a travel on every play. Don't want that BS in my playoff game. If it's not blatantly obvious, I would tell the player when I get a chance, like on a inbound, make sure you get the ball down before you move your feet to start the dribble. Game management, get out of the lane.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

I have to agree with JRutledge. I watched a lot of basketball yesterday and noticed only 2 blatant travels that were not called. Both of them were at the start of the dribble.

I don't think it's an epidemic as the original poster seems to indicate. But I do think that traveling is the toughest call in basketball.

I disagree. All you have to do is determine which foot is the pivot and...

a) ...determine if it's lifted before the dribble begins,
b) ...determine if he steps with it before releasing the ball.

Some of the "jump stops" are BLATANT travels. A player cannot gather the ball and jump off BOTH feet and land. That's a very easy call but I see it ignore constantly, in high school and college, even in the NCAA Tournament when the best of the best are working.

I've read where people say they "don't want my playoff game to turn into a bunch of travel calls." That's a BS copout. If officials were more consistent in calling it, the problem wouldn't exist.

Yes, JAR, you are correct. It's a HUGE disadvantage for the defense.

[JRutledge]

The point that I am trying to make is that travels are called inconsistently at all levels. ALL LEVELS!!! I see many travels that are not travels at all in HS games. I see travels that might need to be called that are not called at the college level. I know in our State Tournament there were calls that I thought without a doubt were blown and were called by the official. If you talked to officials that were standing around watching, we could not always agree what was the right call either way. I do not think NCAA officials make a consistent effort to “pass” on obvious travel calls. I think they do not want to call what they “think” are travels and call what they “know” to be travels. I know there are travel calls I have made that at the time I was confident in when I made the call, only to look at tape and see I was totally wrong or too technical. Also if you actually watch an NBA game, I have seen many travel calls on the star players that people claim they let get away with traveling. I was watching a couple of games and they called 3 or 4 calls in a row on Shaq and Kobe in completely different games. I even saw Lebron get called a couple of times on consecutive times up the floor. I think it is a little overplayed how much are missed consciously. I think we all miss those calls from time to time when we blow the whistle and when we do not blow the whistle. I know it may shock some of you, but NCAA officials are still human beings. When players make all their shots and never turn the ball over, then I will expect 3 people to be perfect and make every single call correctly.

Peace

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by caliref

I think it might be worse in NCAA now than in the NBA. Have not been impressed with some of the things I have seen.

Hey Caliref what part of CA are you from?

[Scrapper1]

As I'm typing this, I just saw a pretty clear travel missed at the beginning of the drive against Purdue. Anyway. . .

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

I disagree. All you have to do is determine which foot is the pivot and...

And, IMHO, this is exactly what makes it such a hard call at the collegiate level. Determining the pivot when a player is moving requires the official to decide if the ball is caught (gathered, secured, whatever) while the player is touching the floor or while airborne. Some of the players are so athletic in their dribble-drive moves that it's VERY difficult to determine precisely which foot (if any) is the pivot when the ball is caught.

I will agree with BktBallRef that there are too many jump stops that are not legal, where the feet don't come down simultaneously. Maybe officials or supervisors consider this "thump-thump" to be splitting hairs.

Defining traveling is very easy. Calling it in a high-tempo game can be very difficult. Again, that's just MHO; and if people disagree, that's fine.

[jkjenning]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Defining traveling is very easy. Calling it in a high-tempo game can be very difficult.

...the type of games where keeping contact under control can reduce an official's awareness of pivot foot.

[boiseball]

in my opinion, traveling is the hardest call to make; the jump stop is the hardest part of the traveling rules; so I have to wholeheartedly disagree with all those who have said it is so easy; I will probably go to my grave still making some traveling calls based on "that definitely did not look right" and passing on others based on the theory that "that looked crazy but I do not think it was a travel." I guess traveling must be my achilles heel

[just another ref]

is a great learning tool for officiating in general and traveling in particular. I have used it many times to check what I thought was a violation. For me personally, a travel has always been one of two calls that I make where the whistle seems to go off by itself and I am making a signal sometimes before I really know what happened. (player control foul is the other call) I was taught, and I believe, that "If it mighta been a travel, it ain't a travel."
(local dialect) Translated, that means there is nothing much worse than a
"phantom violation" call. With this in mind, I frequently say to myself during a game, "That mighta been a travel," without making a call . BUT, when I see one that trips the trigger, so to speak, it's almost out of my hands. Now, in spite of what some of my clever in-laws say, I do not wear a whistle to watch games on tv, but the trigger still gets tripped. I can honestly say that I have never seen a travel, many uncalled, that tripped the trigger and had DVR prove me wrong. Perhaps the worst is the catch by the big guy on the block. He pivots, takes a giant stride into the paint, plants his non-pivot
foot and follows with the pivot. (sometimes a step, sometimes a drag) He squares up, puts up a short shot, and no call.