Jim Burr

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

Jim has been an asset to the officiating community for many years, but I feel his, along with quiet a few others time are up, and now he just needs to retire, wait his couple of years to get on the hall of fame ballot and get in.

Yup, gotta make room for the new breed that don't know or understand the rules and also like to make up some of their own rules--like calling automatic blocks on secondary defenders who have LGP, or "T"s for slapping the backboard while trying to block a shot. Jmo, but I don't think that Burr, Welmer or any other D1 official currently breathing is gonna lose any sleep worrying about you replacing them at any time in the forseeable future.

Other than being an official that (supposedly) just finished his very first year of high school ball, do you have any other qualifications that would enable you to so accurately judge the competency or lack thereof of top-level D1 basketball officials?

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup, gotta make room for the new breed that don't know or understand the rules and also like to make up some of their own rules--like calling automatic blocks on secondary defenders who have LGP, or "T"s for slapping the backboard while trying to block a shot.

I agree, Jim is an awesome official and he looks like he's in great shape for his age. Far as you talking about officials making up their own rules. I've seen Jim do a few non-standard things too. When you see guys at the top of the profession doing whatever they want to do when it comes to mechanics. The message is not strong that the officials below should follow the rules to the letter either, imho.

[jontheref]

Jim Burr's T was just the normal run of the mill T. If he is chewing anyone out he is chewing out the "C" in the Nova game who called a marginal offensive call directly in front of Burr. If its a big game and you get Burr in it I think that one should feel comfortable that the right call is going to be made. I don't get why he is so maligned.

[socalreff]

Originally Posted by jontheref

Jim Burr's T was just the normal run of the mill T. If he is chewing anyone out he is chewing out the "C" in the Nova game who called a marginal offensive call directly in front of Burr. If its a big game and you get Burr in it I think that one should feel comfortable that the right call is going to be made. I don't get why he is so maligned.

He's maligned because he's on TV all the time, so he has a high percentage of visibility for all of us peons to critique. More media games and plays equals more you get wrong publically.

[socalreff]

Also, they would have a much better chance of getting more plays right if they wouldn't call across the key all the time as Lead. Half the time I'm watching, it seems like they don't know there is a Center on the court.

[btaylor64]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup, gotta make room for the new breed that don't know or understand the rules and also like to make up some of their own rules--like calling automatic blocks on secondary defenders who have LGP, or "T"s for slapping the backboard while trying to block a shot. Jmo, but I don't think that Burr, Welmer or any other D1 official currently breathing is gonna lose any sleep worrying about you replacing them at any time in the forseeable future.

Other than being an official that (supposedly) just finished his very first year of high school ball, do you have any other qualifications that would enable you to so accurately judge the competency or lack thereof of top-level D1 basketball officials?

I wouldn't worry about me coming to steal one of there spots anytime soon either. I don't even know if I will ever even get to work a Div. I game ever.

And as far as Welmer being at the top, I don't know if Gerald Bodreaux hired him this year, but I heard John Guthrie fired him when he was the Supervisor of officials cause he didn't think he could get a play right (don't know if that is entirely true, but I can see it being logical)

[Rich]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

I wouldn't worry about me coming to steal one of there spots anytime soon either. I don't even know if I will ever even get to work a Div. I game ever.

And as far as Welmer being at the top, I don't know if Gerald Bodreaux hired him this year, but I heard John Guthrie fired him when he was the Supervisor of officials cause he didn't think he could get a play right (don't know if that is entirely true, but I can see it being logical)

Oh, let's hold the SEC assignor up as a great indicator of how good an official Welmer is.

Then let's all laugh out loud.

[btaylor64]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

Oh, let's hold the SEC assignor up as a great indicator of how good an official Welmer is.

Then let's all laugh out loud.

He has sent more guys to the NBA through his umbrella system then you will ever know.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

He has sent more guys to the NBA through his umbrella system then you will ever know.

Some of us don't hold the NBA as the ultimate ideal. Matter of fact, I haven't watched an NBA game in about 5 years.

If I'm turning on an ESPN and seeing Burr/Welmer 5-6 nights a week, it's a good indication that these are the best guys. Commissioners aren't going to put their necks on the line for guys they don't trust. There's an old saying that "you don't get fired for buying IBM." Well, you won't get fired hiring Burr and Welmer. They're too solid and I can't remember a ****storm ever coming down in one of their games.

The only ****storm I remember with a big time, regular official is the Valentine/Knight incident.

[btaylor64]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

Some of us don't hold the NBA as the ultimate ideal. Matter of fact, I haven't watched an NBA game in about 5 years.

If I'm turning on an ESPN and seeing Burr/Welmer 5-6 nights a week, it's a good indication that these are the best guys. Commissioners aren't going to put their necks on the line for guys they don't trust. There's an old saying that "you don't get fired for buying IBM." Well, you won't get fired hiring Burr and Welmer. They're too solid and I can't remember a ****storm ever coming down in one of their games.

The only ****storm I remember with a big time, regular official is the Valentine/Knight incident.

Don't misinterpret what I'm saying now. I think Burr and Welmer are good... at managing the game, but as far as getting plays right they could never touch an NBA official.

Maybe you don't hold NBA refs in such high regard, but I think when you ref the highest level, at the highest stage, with the best athletes in the world and have a 94% accuracy rate that's dang good in my books. You might disagree with that, but I just do not believe that get near that many plays right.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

Don't misinterpret what I'm saying now. I think Burr and Welmer are good... at managing the game, but as far as getting plays right they could never touch an NBA official.

Maybe you don't hold NBA refs in such high regard, but I think when you ref the highest level, at the highest stage, with the best athletes in the world and have a 94% accuracy rate that's dang good in my books. You might disagree with that, but I just do not believe that get near that many plays right.

What is right? Every foul call is subjective -- was there advantage/disadvantage to the point where the official decided to call a foul?

I live in Big 10 territory and the officials let the players play. It's a very physical league. How could you possibly say those officials are right? Or wrong?

[blindmanwalking]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

Don't misinterpret what I'm saying now. I think Burr and Welmer are good... at managing the game, but as far as getting plays right they could never touch an NBA official.

Maybe you don't hold NBA refs in such high regard, but I think when you ref the highest level, at the highest stage, with the best athletes in the world and have a 94% accuracy rate that's dang good in my books. You might disagree with that, but I just do not believe that get near that many plays right.

Are you seriously comparing college officials to NBA officials? I'm not knocking the NBA guys because they are calling the game the way they are told to (I assume), however, the blatant rules violations and fouls that are never called puts nearly and college or top high school official above NBA guys IMO. I rarely watch NBA ball for this reason.