Liability Issue @ Ortonville

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by mick

If you are interested enough to hang around and want to know about rules from unbiased parties, there be some plenty smart folks here.
mick

Don't let Mick fool you...he's one of them!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by mick

mick


Watchutalkin' 'bout?

We are not worthy....

[jmaellis]

Originally Posted by GreeneFam

I am interested in hearing some opinions from registered officials on this matter.

On Tuesday, January 23rd my stepson participated in a Freshman Boys Basketball game at Brandon High School. Due to poor planning or scheduling, or perhaps just mixed signals, no registered officials were present at this game. Instead, a woman faculty member of Brandon High School, and also what I can only assume was an underaged female student, were asked to "referee" this contest. I'm not quite sure the reasoning behind this decision. Perhaps Brandon didn't want to forfeit the game, or perhaps the parties responsible simply didn't realize the error they were making in this decision.

Am I wrong in assuming that the athletic director of Brandon High School made a huge mistake by allowing these two unregistered females to officiate? Two random unregistered females are not insured in a situation like this. Especially an underaged student. Had an accident happened during that game, both the female "referees" would have been in enormous legal trouble, not to mention the school.

Did Brandon High School violate any laws or rules by allowing this to happen? My son was on the visiting team from Rochester, and a few of us were appalled by this.

Since you didn't mention that the fill-in referees did poorly, I'm assuming that they must have performed at least okay, considering the circumstances. Sounds like BHS tried to make the best of a bad situation. So, why exactly were you "appalled"?

Since you are "appalled" that they played the game without registered officials, I'm assuming that you would have rather the contest be canceled. I'm also assuming that since you and the others were "appalled" by what was happening you didn't allow your son(s) to take the court.

Or are you "appalled" because the referees were female (registered or not)? The fact that the fill-ins were women seems to be a very important to you; you mentioned it several times.

[Bad Zebra]

Lets cut the OP some slack...Seems like (s)he just came to get opinions/info from our perspective. How did this turn into a gender thing? I think we're reading a bit too much into the original post. Doesn't seem like we're being very gracious here with a guest from outside our ranks.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Bad Zebra

Lets cut the OP some slack...Seems like (s)he just came to get opinions/info from our perspective. How did this turn into a gender thing? I think we're reading a bit too much into the original post. Doesn't seem like we're being very gracious here with a guest from outside our ranks.

I have not read anyone attacking the OPer in any way. I think people are explaining some facts that might apply and telling them we do not have all the knowledge of the circumstances. First of all none of us where there at the game site. So I would think that anyone posting on a site would understand that much of this needs to be addressed to the people that are directly involved. For all we know there were registered officials and that their perceptions of who those officials were might be wrong. Who knows, I was not there and neither was anyone else that has responded. It might be a legitimate question, but you have to realize that this is not the place to ask those questions. All this person has to do is call the coach and go from there.

Peace

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I have not read anyone attacking the OPer in any way.

Well, Rut, GarthB did accuse the OP - a couple times - of having a problem with the gender of the substitute officials and implied that was his entire problem...I read it as an attack.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Well, Rut, GarthB did accuse the OP - a couple times - of having a problem with the gender of the substitute officials and implied that was his entire problem...I read it as an attack.

I read it as an observation.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Well, Rut, GarthB did accuse the OP - a couple times - of having a problem with the gender of the substitute officials and implied that was his entire problem...I read it as an attack.

I read that as an observation as well. Now that was not my original observation, but that does not mean I am correct. I guess if someone speaks their mind about something that has to be an attack.

Oh well, carry on with your little accusations.

Peace

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Well, Rut, GarthB did accuse the OP - a couple times - of having a problem with the gender of the substitute officials and implied that was his entire problem...I read it as an attack.

That's not accurate.

I did question whether part of his problem was with women officials. In his entire story, the only people he identified by gender were the women, despite his later claim that he'd have done the same if the officials were men. In reality, there were at least three men in his story, two coaches and the principal, and he didn't find it necessary to identify them by gender. I believe he has shown that part of his problem is that the "referees" were women.

However, I never concluded that this was his entire problem, only that it was involved. When he attempted to play the junior high attitude card, I pulled out of the conversation with him and placed him on my ignore list.

I don't see any of this as an attack.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by GreeneFam

I am interested in hearing some opinions from registered officials on this matter. I will give you my opinion and I think this is a perfect place to ask this question.

Am I wrong in assuming that the athletic director of Brandon High School made a huge mistake by allowing these two unregistered females to officiate? Yes! Two random unregistered females are not insured in a situation like this. Especially an underaged student. Had an accident happened during that game, both the female "referees" would have been in enormous legal trouble (not), not to mention the school. I don't think so.

Did Brandon High School violate any laws or rules by allowing this to happen?

I don't think so. Supply and demand, school was not able to get registered officials but you would be surprise at the # of officials that aren't register working these less than varisty games. IMO, this was a 9th grade game. That's it! The school doesn't charge for fans to come and see a 9th grade game. Only the parents are there to watch this. I think where issues may arise in regards to having certified officials is in the varsity game. School or state administrative boards are not going to want to hear your arguments regarding a 9th grade game and certified officials, but that's jmo. If you want to argue your kid getting hurt, he could get hurt with certified officials as well. If you're worried about this and possibly looking to take legal action, you probably shouldn't have your kid playing this sport.

BTW, all schools have liability insurance on all events. The school is covered insurance wise and that includes attorney fees, in case some parent gets a wild hair up they azz and trys to sue them for some off-the-wall crap.

[GreeneFam]

Originally Posted by Old School

The school doesn't charge for fans to come and see a 9th grade game. Only the parents are there to watch this. I think where issues may arise in regards to having certified officials is in the varsity game. School or state administrative boards are not going to want to hear your arguments regarding a 9th grade game and certified officials, but that's jmo. If you want to argue your kid getting hurt, he could get hurt with certified officials as well. If you're worried about this and possibly looking to take legal action, you probably shouldn't have your kid playing this sport.

Actually our league does charge for 9th grade games, and $5 per ticket at that! Crazy, IMO. Like I stated in an earlier post, I am not at all looking to take legal action. This was merely out of my own curiosity, and resulting from several conversations with other parents. The fact that it was 9th grade and not a Varsity game, in my mind, does not warrant putting players in harm's way by allowing unregistered, uninsured officials to ref the games.

Also to the PP who stated the he/she was a senior in high school and also a registered official, I want to clarify that the principal of the school apologized in an email for letting "unregistered" officials referee the game. The reason I suspected she was not registered was because she was underage and wearing a JV volleyball uniform. The principals admission that she was, in fact, not registered is how I confirmed my suspicion.

[mick]

Originally Posted by GreeneFam

Actually our league does charge for 9th grade games, and $5 per ticket at that! Crazy, IMO.

Shucks! 20 folks show up and the school has paid for two officials and the table, ... but not the lights.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by GreeneFam

Actually our league does charge for 9th grade games, and $5 per ticket at that! Crazy, IMO. Like I stated in an earlier post, I am not at all looking to take legal action. This was merely out of my own curiosity, and resulting from several conversations with other parents. The fact that it was 9th grade and not a Varsity game, in my mind, does not warrant putting players in harm's way by allowing unregistered, uninsured officials to ref the games.

Also to the PP who stated the he/she was a senior in high school and also a registered official, I want to clarify that the principal of the school apologized in an email for letting "unregistered" officials referee the game. The reason I suspected she was not registered was because she was underage and wearing a JV volleyball uniform. The principals admission that she was, in fact, not registered is how I confirmed my suspicion.

I quickly glanced through the posts and I have a question I didn't see asked or answered. So here it is:

Since you were appalled (your word) by the lack of certified referees, did you pull your son off the court?

I'm assuming you did. What did he say?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by GreeneFam

The fact that it was 9th grade and not a Varsity game, in my mind, does not warrant putting players in harm's way by allowing unregistered, uninsured officials to ref the games.

Again, what does your coach say about all this? He put all of the players in harm's way by playing the game, didn't he? Personally, I'd have to say that's just as bad, if not worse, than the other school using unregistered refs? And how do you actually know that those refs were uninsured?

I would never be critical. That's not my nature. But I would like to know all of the facts surrounding this situation before I respond further.

[Johnny Ringo]

I still tink it is a hoax. A quick look at the schools website shows that there was a boys basketball game on the road at Lapeer East and the OP said that tickets to Frosh games were $5 - well, on the website it reads:

Brandon High School Ticket Prices

Varsity Football $5.00
JV & Freshman Football $5.00
Varsity & JV Boys’/Girls’ Basketball $5.00
Freshman Boys’/Girls’ Basketball $3.00
Varsity Hockey $5.00
Wrestling $5.00
Varsity, JV, Freshman Volleyball $5.00
Varsity & JV Boys’/Girls’ Soccer $5.00
Spring Sports (if charged) $5.00

There's a list some nontruth going on here.