2 strange questions...

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BEAREF

Why do you let them sit on the bench if they have on jewelry? Aren't they still considered players.... and players aren't permitted to wear jewelry...you better get them sent to the locker room until it's removed.

They're team members. See case book play 3.5SitB. They can't become players.

[BEAREF]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

No, they aren't considered players.

Are they players during warmups?

[Ignats75]

They are bench personnel. Thats why, if they get whacked for dunking, its an indirect on the coach.

[BEAREF]

OK...but doesn't Rule 3 Section 5 deal with Team Members equipment and apparel? The are team members while on the bench and team members cannot wear jewelry...either they take it off or they're in the locker room. In my opinion if you enforce it on the floor you need to enforce it on the bench as well.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by kbilla

to me there is a benefit to treating players like "adults" when they reach the varsity level and not dictating to them in situations like this

First of all if you are working HS varsity sports, the players are not adults. I have a fundamental problem with these kinds of statements. These are still kids and in most cases are not legally old enough to do much of anything in our society. If you cannot tell a kid to apply to the rule, then I wonder if you have kids do you have problem telling your kids what to do? It is not hard to get a kid to comply or they will not play. If I do not get the kid to comply, I tell their coach and no matter how much hemming and hawing, they comply.

Peace

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You just don't get it, do you? And sadly, it appears that your veteran officials don't get it either.

Where do you officiate, kbilla? Just wondering. I've never heard of any officials group up to now that doesn't enforce jewelry rules by the book in warmups.

i guess i don't "get it" in your world....why does it matter, you coming to my association meetings to tell on me?

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

First of all if you are working HS varsity sports, the players are not adults. I have a fundamental problem with these kinds of statements. These are still kids and in most cases are not legally old enough to do much of anything in our society. If you cannot tell a kid to apply to the rule, then I wonder if you have kids do you have problem telling your kids what to do? It is not hard to get a kid to comply or they will not play. If I do not get the kid to comply, I tell their coach and no matter how much hemming and hawing, they comply.

Peace

you know what's funny, i have NEVER had a problem with this in pre-game. i have told kids to take stuff off and i don't worry about it..i cannot remember the last time i had had a kid come into a game with jewelry on. because you are right, it is not hard to get a kid to comply....

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

First of all if you are working HS varsity sports, the players are not adults. I have a fundamental problem with these kinds of statements. Peace

and this is a matter of opinion. that's fine if you don't think so, but it's a different school of thought....what if the kid is 18, is he an "adult" then? how i treat players might differ from how you treat players, but what i do has worked for me, i very seldom have problems with players or coaches for that matter....do what works for you...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by kbilla

and this is a matter of opinion. that's fine if you don't think so, but it's a different school of thought....what if the kid is 18, is he an "adult" then? how i treat players might differ from how you treat players, but what i do has worked for me, i very seldom have problems with players or coaches for that matter....do what works for you...

Of course it is an opinion. But I was raised by parents that required me to treat adults with respect. I do not care how others do things, but when you deal with me and you are not an adult, I require a certain amount of respect. This is why I do not introduce myself to them as "Jeff." I am not their equal as it relates to age and respect and responsibility. And especially if I am in an authority position over a child, because if something happens to them, guess who they are going to blame? Maybe if there was a general respect for people older than we are, maybe this society would be a better place. Then again, I do not care what others do, I demand respect from children as I would expect any teacher or other adult that deals with kids would require.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by kbilla

i guess i don't "get it" in your world....why does it matter, you coming to my association meetings to tell on me?

Why would I tell on you? You've been saying that your experienced high-level high school officials are doing exactly what you do anyway. If no one in your association is enforcing the rule the way it is written, what use would it be to even bring it up?

I could care less how you and everyone in your association calls it. I just want to make sure that other officials reading this thread know that you and your association are calling it wrong, by rule.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BEAREF

OK...but doesn't Rule 3 Section 5 deal with Team Members equipment and apparel? The are team members while on the bench and team members cannot wear jewelry...either they take it off or they're in the locker room. In my opinion if you enforce it on the floor you need to enforce it on the bench as well.

This is from the COMMENTS ON THE 2001-02 RULES REVISIONS when they implemented the rule:
"The referee shall not permit any 'team member' to wear equipment or apparel which, in his/her judgement is dangerous or confusing to other players or is not appropriate. Of specific concern is the wearing of jewelry during the pre-game warm-up period. Once the officials arrive on the floor and have jurisdiction, even prior to the time the head coach verifies that all players are legally equipped, no team member may have jewelry. Currently there remains no additional penalty other than not being permitted to participate".

Iow you can sit but you can't play.

[BEAREF]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

This is from the COMMENTS ON THE 2001-02 RULES REVISIONS when they implemented the rule:
"The referee shall not permit any 'team member' to wear equipment or apparel which, in his/her judgement is dangerous or confusing to other players or is not appropriate. Of specific concern is the wearing of jewelry during the pre-game warm-up period. Once the officials arrive on the floor and have jurisdiction, even prior to the time the head coach verifies that all players are legally equipped, no team member may have jewelry. Currently there remains no additional penalty other than not being permitted to participate".

Iow you can sit but you can't play.

I guess this works for me.... thanks.