Teaching Lessons?

[Junker]

Taunting should always be penalized no matter what the game situation. It does not belong in high school athletics.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Junker

Taunting should always be penalized no matter what the game situation. It does not belong in high school athletics.

Bravo!!!!!!!!

No. You are assuming somethings that I never said. Don't put words in my mouth or assume something. I explained to you why I thought it not best to call a Technical Foul in that situation. I have very few posts on this forum, and yet someone lumps me in with others who find "another reason to avoid calling a technical foul".

When the last time you were on the court as a player? The ending of a game that you know you are going to lose is agony. To prolong what is a frustrating time, in what may (or may not) have been a hotly contested game in which taunting is going on is asking for disaster. If it was an issue throughout the game, it should have been cleaned up earlier, but to wait and interrupt a running clock with 2 seconds left is not good game management.

[Adam]

If they don't taunt prior to this point, there's no way to clean it up before hand. When it happens, it has to be dealt with. I've been on the court on the losing end of games like this; it's generally scrub time anyway. That's not really relevant, though. If you don't deal with this kind of taunting late in the game, you've got more of a chance of an escalation that adding the time to report and administer a technical foul.

[Junker]

Isn't allowing taunting to happen as potentially dangerous to the game? Allowing a player to taunt is opening the door for a hard foul or worse, a fight. It must be penalized regardless of a game. Last year I got a great feedback from officials and coaches for a taunting T. I had a blow out, late (about a minute left). A player from the winning team made a tremendous block on a fast break. After the block he shook his head at the losing team's bench. I didn't hesistate to throw the T. Did it make the game longer? Absolutely. Were the losing players still frustrated? I assume so, but they knew I wasn't going to allow anyone to rub their noses in it. Taunting is never acceptable.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

No. You are assuming somethings that I never said. Don't put words in my mouth or assume something.

If it was an issue throughout the game, it should have been cleaned up earlier, but to wait and interrupt a running clock with 2 seconds left is not good game management.

OK, I'll comment on something you did say then.

I disagree with your "game management" remark completely. Taunting is unsporting conduct. Refusing to penalize any unsporting conduct at any time during an official's jurisdiction by labelling it "good game management" is completely ludicrous imo. You penalize unsporting conduct when it occurs, without looking for an excuse not to do so.

Again, if a player tells you to FO with 2 seconds to go in a game, are you going to ignore that kind of unsporting behavior under the guise of "good game management" too?

[Junker]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

If it was an issue throughout the game, it should have been cleaned up earlier, but to wait and interrupt a running clock with 2 seconds left is not good game management.

It is good management for the next crew that has that team. By allowing taunting you send the player the message that taunting is OK.

[TriggerMN]

Originally Posted by Junker

Taunting should always be penalized no matter what the game situation. It does not belong in high school athletics.

Taunting does not belong in athletics at all.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by TriggerMN

Taunting does not belong in athletics at all.

I seem to remember you talking some trash the last time we played hoops. Mother Nature don't know no love Dawg! I guess one of the 3 other officials on the floor playing should have T'd you up.

[Adam]

Junker, if you're playing with your whistle, that might explain your jump shot.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

The horn will end the unsporting conduct in 2 seconds. If there is unsporting behavior going on, prolonging the game an additional 2 minutes to call a "T", report it, shoot 2 shots, administer the throw in, and finish the game will only allow for more things to possibly go on. Get this one over with.

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

No. You are assuming somethings that I never said. Don't put words in my mouth or assume something. I explained to you why I thought it not best to call a Technical Foul in that situation. I have very few posts on this forum, and yet someone lumps me in with others who find "another reason to avoid calling a technical foul".

When the last time you were on the court as a player? The ending of a game that you know you are going to lose is agony. To prolong what is a frustrating time, in what may (or may not) have been a hotly contested game in which taunting is going on is asking for disaster. If it was an issue throughout the game, it should have been cleaned up earlier, but to wait and interrupt a running clock with 2 seconds left is not good game management.

Your comments couldn't be more contrary to what the NFHS wants its officials to do. This was the #1 Point of Emphasis a couple of years ago and probably will have to be again in a year or two because people such as yourself continue to refuse to address it properly.
2003-04 POINTS OF EMPHASIS

1.Sporting Behavior (Repeated from 2002-03, except shaded area)
The committee discussed specific, inappropriate situations that must be stopped immediately. Coaches must demonstrate leadership by immediately putting an end to these practices. Officials must be prepared to stop these unsporting acts and penalize the offending team(s).>>
A. Taunting/Self-Promotion: Players are increasingly directing their celebratory actions toward opponents, which should be interpreted as taunting and baiting, and penalized accordingly.

Originally Posted by Junker

Isn't allowing taunting to happen as potentially dangerous to the game? Allowing a player to taunt is opening the door for a hard foul or worse, a fight. It must be penalized regardless of a game. Last year I got a great feedback from officials and coaches for a taunting T. I had a blow out, late (about a minute left). A player from the winning team made a tremendous block on a fast break. After the block he shook his head at the losing team's bench. I didn't hesistate to throw the T. Did it make the game longer? Absolutely. Were the losing players still frustrated? I assume so, but they knew I wasn't going to allow anyone to rub their noses in it. Taunting is never acceptable.

I agree with the situation with one minute left. I also agree with cleaning up the taunting...but with 2 seconds left? Its very easy to get on an on-line forum and say you would make this call, but I doubt ANYONE on here blows his whistle and calls a "T" for this with 2 seconds left in a game.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

I agree with the situation with one minute left. I also agree with cleaning up the taunting...but with 2 seconds left? Its very easy to get on an on-line forum and say you would make this call, but I doubt ANYONE on here blows his whistle and calls a "T" for this with 2 seconds left in a game.

I called a T for disagreeing with an official's call with well under a minute left in a game that the team was losing something like 85 - 29.

As to the OP, I wasn't there, I don't know what was said, I don't know what led to it, I don't know how obvious it was. I would address it, but that might be issuing a T or might be talking to the player and / or the coach.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

I agree with the situation with one minute left. I also agree with cleaning up the taunting...but with 2 seconds left? Its very easy to get on an on-line forum and say you would make this call, but I doubt ANYONE on here blows his whistle and calls a "T" for this with 2 seconds left in a game.

I would and would have no qualms at all about it. I T'd a player for taunting late in a blow-out of a military intra-mural game. After the call the guy came up to me and said "but he's my next door neighbor, I was just joking with him!" I told him it didn't matter, I can't take the chance of a fight breaking out, save the trash talk for after the game.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by PAOfficial

I agree with the situation with one minute left. I also agree with cleaning up the taunting...but with 2 seconds left? Its very easy to get on an on-line forum and say you would make this call, but I doubt ANYONE on here blows his whistle and calls a "T" for this with 2 seconds left in a game.

I'd call that "T" with 2 seconds left. Every time.

Not one official here has agreed with your "game management" philosophy. The NFHS rulesmakers want taunting called without exception- from the start of the pre-game warm-up until the players leave the court. Doesn't that ...um....maybe tell you something?

Again, PAOfficial, do you ignore it also if a player tells you to FO with 2 seconds to go?