A couple questions from today's games

[Adam]

JV boys and girls today (not necessarily in that order). Boys game, home coach is screaming for 3 seconds; I finally blow the whistle at about 6 and make the call. Visiting coach tries to tell me the count is suspended during a loose ball.
Me: "Coach, team control continues, so the three second count continues."

Coach: "It doesn't have anything to do with team control."

Me: " "

Now, my question here: Am I remembering correctly that the coach would have been right with this argument during a game several years ago?

Next question: A1 gets the ball while sitting on her Dexter, and in the process of trying to pass the ball leans back and nearly lays down. Question, had she laid down, would it have been traveling?
No, she never moved her pivot cheek.

Third question: If the pony tail touches the floor OOB while the player is holding the ball, do you call the violation? This was in the varsity game I was watching.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

1) Now, my question here: Am I remembering correctly that the coach would have been right with this argument during a game several years ago?

2) Next question: A1 gets the ball while sitting on her Dexter, and in the process of trying to pass the ball leans back and nearly lays down. Question, had she laid down, would it have been traveling?
No, she never moved her pivot cheek.

3) Third question: If the pony tail touches the floor OOB while the player is holding the ball, do you call the violation? This was in the varsity game I was watching.

1) Changed in 2002-03. Before that the 3-second count was suspended during an interrupted dribble--i.e. when the ball is loose.

2) If it's legal to sit up after laying flat on your back, I can't see why it would be illegal to reverse the process.

3) Sigh. Had to bring it up, didn't ya? It's an OOB violation. This exact play was posted on the NFHS web site last year as a case play, but it never made it into this year's case book.

[Mountaineer]

I agree with JR.

On 3 seconds, I'm assuming you are trying to talk the players out of the lane before the whistle. Also, I find it amusing on a situation where a coach is crying for 3 seconds to go to the other end and hit his team with it. Of course that call depends on if it's a legitimate 3 seconds and how much he's whining.

[Adam]

I'd talked them out of the lane all day. This time, however, there was a kid about 10 feet from the hoop, got trapped in amongst the trees, and by the time I actually started counting, the ball had been knocked loose.
I made the call, and turned to the home coach and told him I know how to count. Probably not the best thing to say, but I was tired of his bellyaching and he got the point.

[Mountaineer]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I'd talked them out of the lane all day. This time, however, there was a kid about 10 feet from the hoop, got trapped in amongst the trees, and by the time I actually started counting, the ball had been knocked loose.
I made the call, and turned to the home coach and told him I know how to count. Probably not the best thing to say, but I was tired of his bellyaching and he got the point.

Personally, I have no problem with what you said to the coach! Screaming for you to call 3 seconds does not constitute coaching at any level.

[Official99]

Originally Posted by Mountaineer

I agree with JR.

On 3 seconds, I'm assuming you are trying to talk the players out of the lane before the whistle. Also, I find it amusing on a situation where a coach is crying for 3 seconds to go to the other end and hit his team with it. Of course that call depends on if it's a legitimate 3 seconds and how much he's whining.

Why talk them out of the lane... one time "get out of the paint", if they don't move and as soon as they get the advantage (i.e. pass in their direction, set a screen, etc...) blow it and send it the other way.

At least that is the way we do it around here. Personally I hate the 3 second rule. Too many coaches use that as their all time excuse and don't understand the interpretation. If the kid is just standing in the corner of the box, not moving, no getting into any position, but standing there; there is no advantage and no reason to kill the play... anyways; I digress!

If you are at the JV level, you shouldn't have to coach the players out of the box, if they don't get it after the first "get out of the paint" warning - sorry, you lost it!

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by Official99

Why talk them out of the lane... one time "get out of the paint", if they don't move and as soon as they get the advantage (i.e. pass in their direction, set a screen, etc...) blow it and send it the other way.

At least that is the way we do it around here. Personally I hate the 3 second rule. Too many coaches use that as their all time excuse and don't understand the interpretation. If the kid is just standing in the corner of the box, not moving, no getting into any position, but standing there; there is no advantage and no reason to kill the play... anyways; I digress!

If you are at the JV level, you shouldn't have to coach the players out of the box, if they don't get it after the first "get out of the paint" warning - sorry, you lost it!

If you're not going to call a player for just standing there in the corner, why not just tell him to get out? You know the coach is going to have a fit because that's the only kid he'll see on the floor.

[Mark Dexter]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Next question: A1 gets the ball while sitting on her Dexter

I don't recall anyone sitting on me yesterday.

[Rusty Gilbert]

When I see a player in the lingering in the lane, I will say one word..."Lane." It's not coaching, it's not telling players what to do or what not to do (such as "get out of the lane.") No one can accuse me of helping one team. It's just a word........and whoever happens to hear it can take it however they want to.

I will usually do this a handful of times in a game.

After I say the word "Lane" and they continue to linger I count. If I get to 3 seconds and the player is still in the lane, I blow the whistle and call the violation (always while player is STILL there).

If coach is yelling 3 seconds, I use a couple of different responses.

Initially, "coach, I don't need any help counting."

Second time, "coach, when you holler a number while I'm counting it confuses me and I have to start over."

I don't remember them hollering anymore.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gilbert

Initially, "coach, I don't need any help counting."

Second time, "coach, when you holler a number while I'm counting it confuses me and I have to start over."

That one I don't recommend. It's petty and confrontational. You're telling the coach that you're ignoring a violation just because they asked about one. Jmo, but I'd forget about using that one.

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

That one I don't recommend. It's petty and confrontational. You're telling the coach that you're ignoring a violation just because they asked about one. Jmo, but I'd forget about using that one.

So probably saying, "From now on coach, you can save your breath and I'll just ASSUME you're yelling three seconds" is right out.

[bigdogrunnin]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

So probably saying, "From now on coach, you can save your breath and I'll just ASSUME you're yelling three seconds"

PRICELESS!

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gilbert

If coach is yelling 3 seconds, I use a couple of different responses.

Initially, "coach, I don't need any help counting."

Second time, "coach, when you holler a number while I'm counting it confuses me and I have to start over."

I don't remember them hollering anymore.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

That one I don't recommend. It's petty and confrontational. You're telling the coach that you're ignoring a violation just because they asked about one. Jmo, but I'd forget about using that one.

I love that one! It's priceless! It's humorous, and it lightens the moment. If the coach can't handle a little humor, tough. Oh, and nobody ignoring a violation, you're screaming at me and it threw my count off, and btw, thanks for telling the player to get out of the lane for me.

Seriously, I don't even address a coach for screaming 3 seconds, 5 seconds, whatever. I would only address the coach on something like this, if after the play has gone the other way, and he/she is still complaining about it, I come back down from the other end, and still complaining, TECHNICAL FOUL! Constant complaining....That kind of cleans it up too, imo!

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Official99

Why talk them out of the lane... one time "get out of the paint", if they don't move and as soon as they get the advantage (i.e. pass in their direction, set a screen, etc...) blow it and send it the other way.

At least that is the way we do it around here. Personally I hate the 3 second rule. Too many coaches use that as their all time excuse and don't understand the interpretation. If the kid is just standing in the corner of the box, not moving, no getting into any position, but standing there; there is no advantage and no reason to kill the play... anyways; I digress!

If you are at the JV level, you shouldn't have to coach the players out of the box, if they don't get it after the first "get out of the paint" warning - sorry, you lost it!

The kids had been actually pretty good about it. I only needed to mention it one time, and they would get out. Probably happened 2 or 3 times prior to this. Let's not assume I spent the entire time whining, "Come on guys, please get out of the lane. No, seriously, I'm going to blow my whistle. Really, I will."

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Old School

I love that one! It's priceless! It's humorous, and it lightens the moment. If the coach can't handle a little humor, tough. Oh, and nobody ignoring a violation, you're screaming at me and it threw my count off, and btw, thanks for telling the player to get out of the lane for me.

Seriously, I don't even address a coach for screaming 3 seconds, 5 seconds, whatever. I would only address the coach on something like this, if after the play has gone the other way, and he/she is still complaining about it, I come back down from the other end, and still complaining, TECHNICAL FOUL! Constant complaining....That kind of cleans it up too, imo!

This from someone who claims there's no limit to how many warnings you can give a coach as long as it avoids a technical foul for the sake of game management? Nice.