The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 05:15pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Wherever the Army sends me this year
Posts: 267
Long Toss Mechanics?

Team A leads 72-71 with 2 seconds remaining. B has a throw-in under their own basket. They throw a long pass to the opposite end of the court. Other than the thrower, the other nine players are all at the opposite end of the court so you know a long pass is coming. It is very tough to see if the ball is touched or not. It goes out of bounds. The Lead official (along Team B's baseline) did a chopping motion when the ball appeared to touch a Team B player on the long pass. The clock runs out and the officials call the game over and leave the floor. I have never been in this situation but it could happen in any game. How do you handle this? Who chops the clock in? Do you let the lead do it since he has the best vantage point of the long pass? Or does the lead have some signal to the trail at the other end of the court to let him know the ball was tipped and the clock should start? Lastly, if this happens and the clock starts and runs out, would you leave the court immediately or do you come together and discuss this as a crew? I did see the lead official after the game and he said that B1 definitely touched the ball on the long pass so the clock was properly started. I am just wondering if anyone know how this should be handled mechanically. Or, do we leave it to the clock operator (who already made couple of errors)?
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 05:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 14,995
1. If the inbounder is not being pressured as in your situation, then the Trail can stand way up by the 28' mark in the backcourt or perhaps even near the division line and bounce the ball to the thrower. This will give him a better view of the nine players in the frontcourt. Chances are that the thrower putting a toe on the line isn't going to be called anyway. So there really isn't any action in the backcourt to observe. Just make sure the the thrower doesn't commit an OBVIOUS violation.

2. The Trail should retain the chop responsibility, since that is what the timer is going to expect. You could instruct that person differently during the prior stoppage though. This is where the 3-person system really has an edge over 2-person. You have a Center official to help with these full court plays.

3. I would hope that the officials would communicate if the ball was NOT touched and the game shouldn't be over. I would definitely want the Lead to come and bring this information to me, if I were the Trail. We have definite knowledge of what the clock should show in this case and it is an easy fix.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 05:29pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Wherever the Army sends me this year
Posts: 267
The one thinh I didn't do was look at the trail to see if he chopped the clock or not. I was at the frontcourt end so the trail may have properly chopped it.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 05:33pm
Rich's Avatar
Get away from me, Steve.
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 15,770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref
1. If the inbounder is not being pressured as in your situation, then the Trail can stand way up by the 28' mark in the backcourt or perhaps even near the division line and bounce the ball to the thrower. This will give him a better view of the nine players in the frontcourt. Chances are that the thrower putting a toe on the line isn't going to be called anyway. So there really isn't any action in the backcourt to observe. Just make sure the the thrower doesn't commit an OBVIOUS violation.

2. The Trail should retain the chop responsibility, since that is what the timer is going to expect. You could instruct that person differently during the prior stoppage though. This is where the 3-person system really has an edge over 2-person. You have a Center official to help with these full court plays.

3. I would hope that the officials would communicate if the ball was NOT touched and the game shouldn't be over. I would definitely want the Lead to come and bring this information to me, if I were the Trail. We have definite knowledge of what the clock should show in this case and it is an easy fix.
I really wouldn't recommend #1. I wouldn't want to try calling that violation from the 28' line. And it is something we'd need to be aware of, especially in this situation.

Yeah, hire 3
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 05:49pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Stand at the free throw line and administer the throwin. When the pass is released, sprint down court to get into position.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 06:51pm
Huck Finn
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,347
What the...? This is Johnny's first post


Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyrao
I have never been in this situation but it could happen in any game.
And this is his second post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyrao
The one thinh I didn't do was look at the trail to see if he chopped the clock or not. I was at the frontcourt end so the trail may have properly chopped it.

Either I'm reading this wrong - which is possible - or someone's credibility just went down.
__________________
"Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are." -- John Wooden
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 06:53pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Tomegun, methinks he was watching the game rather than officiating it. He was watching the lead but not the trail as a spectator.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 06:56pm
Huck Finn
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,347
Besides this whole, "I had a friend who..." crap, I think you should stay in your normal position and watch the inbounder. Truste your partner(s) to help you down the court. Yes, there are advantages to getting up the court quickly. However, if you are trail opposite the table and the other coach, or an assistant, sees the inbounder clearly step in bounds then what? Most of the time nothing will happen (I'm assuming because I have NOT been in a funky situation like this) but there are many things that could happen.
__________________
"Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are." -- John Wooden
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 06:56pm
Huck Finn
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,347
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells
Tomegun, methinks he was watching the game rather than officiating it. He was watching the lead but not the trail as a spectator.
I hope that is what happened.
__________________
"Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are." -- John Wooden
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 07:07pm
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref
Chances are that the thrower putting a toe on the line isn't going to be called anyway.
Gee, I would certainly hope that it wouldn't be called. The thrower putting a toe(or even a shoelace) on the line is not a violation. Really. Ol' JR wouldn't lie to you, Nevada. But......putting a toe over the line is a violation. It's true, it's true....

Do you need a rules citation for that?

Always glad to help......
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 07:12pm
Huck Finn
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,347
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Gee, I would certainly hope that it wouldn't be called. The thrower putting a toe(or even a shoelace) on the line is not a violation. Really. Ol' JR wouldn't lie to you, Nevada. But......putting a toe over the line is a violation. It's true, it's true....

Do you need a rules citation for that?

Always glad to help......
He got you on that one Nevada. Tell Tony and Justin you blew a rule.
__________________
"Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are." -- John Wooden
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 07:20pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 14,995
Yep, he's right. Better watch what I type with him around. I owe beers.

PS I work with TR on Wednesday.

PPS Just saw your new tag line. Made me laugh out loud!
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Sun Dec 31, 2006, 08:43pm
Huck Finn
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 3,347
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref
PPS Just saw your new tag line. Made me laugh out loud!
Yeah, you know I always give a stop sign.
__________________
"Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are." -- John Wooden
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jan 01, 2007, 03:16am
In Memoriam
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Hell
Posts: 20,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun
Yeah, you know I always give a stop sign.
Yabut.....sometimes your stop sign is in the form of a "T" instead of an open hand- depending on how quickly you want 'em to stop.

Last edited by Jurassic Referee; Mon Jan 01, 2007 at 03:52am.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jan 01, 2007, 11:11am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Wherever the Army sends me this year
Posts: 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun
I hope that is what happened.

That is exactly what happened. Unfortunately, all of the schools our association works had away tournaments so we had no games. This was a local tournament so I went and watched. That's also why I didn't know the crew. I was sitting about even with the foul line in the frontcourt, in the stands. I wish I was on the court. Once again, I am not criticizing these guys. It made me wonder how to properly do this since the trail maybe could not have seen if the ball was touched or not.

Last edited by johnnyrao; Mon Jan 01, 2007 at 11:13am.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Coin Toss Mechanics ljudge Football 8 Fri Nov 25, 2005 06:19pm
Honig's "long toss" heavier flag? biglaz Football 0 Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:54pm
Would you toss em?? drumbum565 Baseball 6 Thu Jul 28, 2005 01:17pm
Coin Toss Mechanics jjrye22 Football 12 Tue Jun 22, 2004 01:46pm
New NCAA mechanics - Long switch or no long switch? jimcrket Basketball 5 Mon Oct 15, 2001 01:40pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:04am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1