Correctable error

[lukealex]

On the 10th foul by team B, A1 is shooting a non-shooting foul. I called the foul, told my partner two shots, but he either missed it, didn't hear, or forgot. Not real important.

Partner calls for a 1 and 1, A1 shoots first shot, misses, B1 rebounds. I blew my whistle immediately and called for a second shot. A1 shoots seconds, makes, B gets ball OOB.

My question is, since after the first shot the ball was live, should I have treated this as a correctable error, cleared the lane, then gave B the ball at POI?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by lukealex

Partner calls for a 1 and 1, A1 shoots first shot, misses, B1 rebounds. I blew my whistle immediately and called for a second shot.

I think as long as you blew the whistle immediately and didn't let play continue, this is not treated as a correctable error. Basically, (IMO) the ball became dead on the miss. The players didn't realize it, but you reminded them.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

I think as long as you blew the whistle immediately and didn't let play continue, this is not treated as a correctable error. Basically, (IMO) the ball became dead on the miss. The players didn't realize it, but you reminded them.

What rule made the ball become dead on the miss? The whistle was blown after B1 rebounded.

[Rick Durkee]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

What rule made the ball become dead on the miss? The whistle was blown after B1 rebounded.

Rule 6-7-2-a.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Rick Durkee

Rule 6-7-2-a.

While that's one of my favorite all-time rules too, it isn't applicable to this situation. The Lead announced 1/1 and that's what B1 played to. A missed first FT on a 1/1 is live.

Don't forget that nothing was corrected yet until after B1 caught the rebound.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

While that's one of my favorite all-time rules too, it isn't applicable to this situation. The Lead announced 1/1 and that's what B1 played to. A missed first FT on a 1/1 is live.

If I know the ball is dead, does it really matter what the rebounder thinks?

I agree that if we all have a brain cramp and think that the rebound is live, then we have a correctable error. But Luke "immediately" stopped play to remind them that the ball was dead. Doesn't that count for something?

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

What rule made the ball become dead on the miss? The whistle was blown after B1 rebounded.

Rick beat me to it, but doesn't the ball become dead when it is to be followed by another FT? That's what the situation was here, right? 2 shot foul, except that the ref said the wrong thing. Ball becomes dead after the first FT. Luke's whistle just reminded everybody that the ball was already dead. No?

[Rick Durkee]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Rick beat me to it, but doesn't the ball become dead when it is to be followed by another FT? That's what the situation was here, right? 2 shot foul, except that the ref said the wrong thing. Ball becomes dead after the first FT. Luke's whistle just reminded everybody that the ball was already dead. No?

In addition, I think you can find some support for what he did in Case 8.6.1. I realize it is the "opposite" situation, but it's also a situation that is more problematic. Even in that case, he should blow the whistle and make the ball dead. I think it must be appropriate in his situation.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Rick Durkee

In addition, I think you can find some support for what he did in Case 8.6.1. I realize it is the "opposite" situation, but it's also a situation that is more problematic. Even in that case, he should blow the whistle and make the ball dead. I think it must be appropriate in his situation.

In addition, I think that case play isn't applicable either.

[lukealex]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Rick beat me to it, but doesn't the ball become dead when it is to be followed by another FT? That's what the situation was here, right? 2 shot foul, except that the ref said the wrong thing. Ball becomes dead after the first FT. Luke's whistle just reminded everybody that the ball was already dead. No?

I would think since my partner said 1 and 1, the ball wouldn't be dead after the first miss, therefor I should have administered the second free throw with the lane cleared.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by lukealex

I would think since my partner said 1 and 1, the ball wouldn't be dead after the first miss, therefor I should have administered the second free throw with the lane cleared.

1) What was the problem with this play?
ANSWER: There was a failure to award a merited free throw. Rule 2-10-1.

2) Can the failure to award the merited free throw be corrected.
ANSWER: Yes, if the error is caught no later than during the first dead ball after the clock has started. Rule 2-10-2.

3) Was the error caught in time to be correctable?
ANSWER:Yes.

4) How do you correct the error?
ANSWER: By using rule 2-10-6. You shoot the merited FT and then go to the POI to rectify the error.

5) What was the POI when the error was caught?
ANSWER: The POI was after B1 caught the missed first FT.

[Junker]

I would handle it the same way as scrapper1, but by rule you might be right about point of interruption. I'd like to hear some of the people that interpret rules have a go at that one. Keep the good questions coming today. I'm finishing up my standardized testing at school and need something to do between my walks around the room.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by Junker

I would handle it the same way as scrapper1, but by rule you might be right about point of interruption. I'd like to hear some of the people that interpret rules have a go at that one. Keep the good questions coming today. I'm finishing up my standardized testing at school and need something to do between my walks around the room.

Ohhh I remember those days! I always wondered what they did in between explaining the directions...now I know.

Anyways, I understand where scrapper is coming from, however, I think you have to clear the lane and let A1 shoot his/her second free throw then go POI. If coach B knew the rules, then you let A shoot the second and A got the rebound....oh boy, there'd be a hay day.

[Gimlet25id]

Originally Posted by lukealex

On the 10th foul by team B, A1 is shooting a non-shooting foul. I called the foul, told my partner two shots, but he either missed it, didn't hear, or forgot. Not real important.

Partner calls for a 1 and 1, A1 shoots first shot, misses, B1 rebounds. I blew my whistle immediately and called for a second shot. A1 shoots seconds, makes, B gets ball OOB.

My question is, since after the first shot the ball was live, should I have treated this as a correctable error, cleared the lane, then gave B the ball at POI?

I'm sorry guys I don't see a problem with the way this was handled. Even though the admin. official announced 1 & 1 the calling official knew it was 2 shots. I'm thinking the best thing to do is blow your whistle and just simply announce 1 more shot with the box filled. This doesn't seem any different then when a official announces 2 shots form the get go and the low blocks forget that it is 2 shots and immediately go in for a rebound. We would just simply remind them of the fact we are shooting 2.

Now if the calling official and the admin. official both said 1 & 1 when it should've been 2 & B rebounds with no whistle and play continues with time coming off the clock then I can see invoking Rule 2-10. In the case the calling official said he hit his whistle immediately. Why not go ahead and line them up and give the other shot?

I keep looking at the case book as I write this post. It sounds like either would work. I guess it all depends when the calling official hit his whistle to stop play. I think whether I go correctable or not would be if time ran off the clock. If no time runs off and my whistle or the whistle is right before or either right @ the rebound being controlled would dictate the ruling. It seems easiest, if you can get by with it, to line them back up and shoot the other throw.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Gimlet25id

I'm sorry guys I don't see a problem with the way this was handled. Even though the admin. official announced 1 & 1 the calling official knew it was 2 shots. I'm thinking the best thing to do is blow your whistle and just simply announce 1 more shot with the box filled. This doesn't seem any different then when a official announces 2 shots form the get go and the low blocks forget that it is 2 shots and immediately go in for a rebound. We would just simply remind them of the fact we are shooting 2.

Now if the calling official and the admin. official both said 1 & 1 when it should've been 2 & B rebounds with no whistle and play continues with time coming off the clock then I can see invoking Rule 2-10. In the case the calling official said he hit his whistle immediately. Why not go ahead and line them up and give the other shot?

I keep looking at the case book as I write this post. It sounds like either would work. I guess it all depends when the calling official hit his whistle to stop play. I think whether I go correctable or not would be if time ran off the clock. If no time runs off and my whistle or the whistle is right before or either right @ the rebound being controlled would dictate the ruling. It seems easiest, if you can get by with it, to line them back up and shoot the other throw.

Agreed. The case book play which dealt with the opposite of this situation points out that action was necessary because the misinformation put someone at a disadvantage. In this case that is not true. Shoot the other free throw and forget it.