Coverage Areas

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

...think of it this way - there are three types of fouls: 1) Oh, that's a foul...2) Oh my, that's a foul...and 3) OH MY GOD!!

So where does "YOU CAN'T F'ING DO THAT??!!" fall in this ordering? Between 2 & 3? after 3?

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

So where does "YOU CAN'T F'ING DO THAT??!!" fall in this ordering? Between 2 & 3? after 3?

Ha...you say tomato, I say tu-mah-toe...my #3 and your vulgar statement would be the same thing - you just happen to be more uncouth than I...

[tomegun]

I just got back from a college game and guess what? Nobody made a call that was right in front of someone else. It was a good game too. The home team was up by 19 at halftime and it went into overtime (It is too early in the season for that). We had a little bit of everything in the game and I finally (it has only been two games, but some would say that is a long time for me ) called my first T in Miss. A kid blocked a shot and wanted to get up in the kid's face. He said, "But I didn't say anything." Yeah, whatever WHACK!

David & Gimlet, many people have put a lot of work into making this 3-man system the best it can be - for right now. After 6 years of MS and JV ball you can't possibly have a good enough handle on this thing to know something better to do. That is what I believe.

[Gimlet25id]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I just got back from a college game and guess what? Nobody made a call that was right in front of someone else. It was a good game too. The home team was up by 19 at halftime and it went into overtime (It is too early in the season for that). We had a little bit of everything in the game and I finally (it has only been two games, but some would say that is a long time for me ) called my first T in Miss. A kid blocked a shot and wanted to get up in the kid's face. He said, "But I didn't say anything." Yeah, whatever WHACK!

David & Gimlet, many people have put a lot of work into making this 3-man system the best it can be - for right now. After 6 years of MS and JV ball you can't possibly have a good enough handle on this thing to know something better to do. That is what I believe.

Good to hear you had a good game.! "T" already & a OT! To address your comment...I have worked longer then six years and I don't work MS or any JV ball. I work @ all 3 levels of College basketball. My original comment to Dave was that it's not black and white that there are times that you would have to make a call out of your primary....which I believe all of my posts details. I also said that the mechanics end of calling 3 is there for a reason. It gives the officials a guideline to be in the best possible position to have the best look @ any given play to make the best possible call. My answer to Dave's OP is that most of the time you stay in your primary, but there are times you have to come out to get plays (WHALES). However rarely it might be it still happens. Then most of the posts that came in were suggesting that somehow thats condoling "ball watching"

[drinkeii]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I just got back from a college game and guess what? Nobody made a call that was right in front of someone else. It was a good game too. The home team was up by 19 at halftime and it went into overtime (It is too early in the season for that). We had a little bit of everything in the game and I finally (it has only been two games, but some would say that is a long time for me ) called my first T in Miss. A kid blocked a shot and wanted to get up in the kid's face. He said, "But I didn't say anything." Yeah, whatever WHACK!

David & Gimlet, many people have put a lot of work into making this 3-man system the best it can be - for right now. After 6 years of MS and JV ball you can't possibly have a good enough handle on this thing to know something better to do. That is what I believe.

And that is the statement made by anyone who is used to a system and refuses to look at possible changes to it for whatever reason.

Just because it is the way we've always done it doesn't make it the right way to do it or the best way to do it or the only way to do it.

I'm not advocating major changes - I'm saying we need to be willing to call (and accept calls) from partners that are outside their arbitrarily defined area of responsibility. As I said, if the mechanics were so important to the integrity of the game, they would include them in the rules, and say "This official has the right to call anything in their area, and nothing outside their area". They define everything else very exactly in the rules, and if it is THAT important, maybe it should be in there. Or maybe, because it isn't that important, or because they feel officials should have the right to call anything anywhere (and I'm not saying you should all the time...but the option is there if necessary), that is what the rules say. Seriously - if it is THAT important that you stay only in your area, have them put it in the rules. Then no one would call outside their area because they're not allowed to.

And don't come back with "Go ahead and call stuff everywhere, see what happens" - that is just a silly response.

I'm curious as to what the outcome of ONE game where no one called outside their area has to do with this discussion?

[Jurassic Referee]

David, go ahead and call stuff everywhere and see what happens.

Seriously.

Give it a try and let us know how it works out.

[drinkeii]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

David, go ahead and call stuff everywhere and see what happens.

Seriously.

Give it a try and let us know how it works out.

That definitely explains the reason this conversation went the way it did - people not reading posts, understanding them, and replying in an intelligent manner. At no time have I ever advocated this. However, apparently that is what you think occasionally reaching out into areas the mechanics-gods have defined as off limits (or the basketball will explode, mass chaos everywhere, end-of-the-world stuff will happen) means - call everything everywhere.

I think I'm done with this thread.

The board in general is very useful for clearing things up. However, when people make decisions based simply on "that is the way we do things", I have a bit of a problem with that. I have with everything I have done, including several emergency service volunteer jobs I have been involved in for close to 20 years, teaching, and several other things. Just because it is the way it has always been done, doesn't make it right. Period. End of story. Thanks for the input.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by drinkeii

That definitely explains the reason this conversation went the way it did - people not reading posts, understanding them, and replying in an intelligent manner. At no time have I ever advocated this. However, apparently that is what you think occasionally reaching out into areas the mechanics-gods have defined as off limits (or the basketball will explode, mass chaos everywhere, end-of-the-world stuff will happen) means - call everything everywhere.

David, it is not about people not reading your posts. They just do not agree with your point of view. I think people do have the right to disagree with you.

Originally Posted by drinkeii

I think I'm done with this thread.

That might be a good idea.

Originally Posted by drinkeii

The board in general is very useful for clearing things up. However, when people make decisions based simply on "that is the way we do things", I have a bit of a problem with that. I have with everything I have done, including several emergency service volunteer jobs I have been involved in for close to 20 years, teaching, and several other things. Just because it is the way it has always been done, doesn't make it right. Period. End of story. Thanks for the input.

The reality is you have not listened to anything others have said at all. I cannot speak for everyone, but I really do not care how long things have been done. All I know is the mechanics work. If you do not think they do, maybe this is the reason you are still working with the people you are. I do not it is a free country and you should do what you feel is best. No one here is going to work with you or hire you. You do things you want to and I wish you the best. But stop trying to tell us what we believe and why we believe what we do. No one has even claimed they are using mechanics because that is what we have done for years. Not every idea is a good one and not everyone has to accept your point of view because you spout it to the world. I do not care what they did 30 years ago. I just know that what we are doing right now works.

Peace

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by drinkeii

And that is the statement made by anyone who is used to a system and refuses to look at possible changes to it for whatever reason.

Just because it is the way we've always done it doesn't make it the right way to do it or the best way to do it or the only way to do it.

I'm not advocating major changes - I'm saying we need to be willing to call (and accept calls) from partners that are outside their arbitrarily defined area of responsibility. As I said, if the mechanics were so important to the integrity of the game, they would include them in the rules, and say "This official has the right to call anything in their area, and nothing outside their area". They define everything else very exactly in the rules, and if it is THAT important, maybe it should be in there. Or maybe, because it isn't that important, or because they feel officials should have the right to call anything anywhere (and I'm not saying you should all the time...but the option is there if necessary), that is what the rules say. Seriously - if it is THAT important that you stay only in your area, have them put it in the rules. Then no one would call outside their area because they're not allowed to.

And don't come back with "Go ahead and call stuff everywhere, see what happens" - that is just a silly response.

I'm curious as to what the outcome of ONE game where no one called outside their area has to do with this discussion?

Funny, where I come from, every year we get a rules book and a copy of THE OFFICIALS MANUAL so that whole "If it were so important it would be in the rules," BS just doesn't fly...for those of us capable of understanding, that means it is considered just as important as the rules.