NFHS 2006 Part 1 TEST

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is unprofessional for someone to give out a test that they are going to see in a matter of days?



If someone is asking for the test where I live, it is likely they did not get their copy in the mail yet. Since our officiating packets are sent out by 3rd class mail (which means the mail carrier can deliver the mail anytime they get ready), there are many times when people go weeks without receiving them. It is a common practice for us to hand out the test to those who have not received them in the mail. We have until November 20 to complete the test. And if someone really wanted to, they can also take the test online before they get the rulebooks. It just would help if someone had the current rulebooks so they can look up yearly changes.



You just need to get the stick out of your *** and stop thinking that the standards you live with for taking the test are not the same standards the rest of us are under.

Peace

Professional, Ethical, and High Standards...if you are going to criticize me for the having all of these go right ahead. I can sleep at night just fine.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

Professional, Ethical, and High Standards...if you are going to criticize me for the having all of these go right ahead. I can sleep at night just fine.

I am accusing you of having "wrong standards." High standards are going to vary from one place to another. I bet if we talked about how you dress going to games those standards would vary greatly across the country.

Peace

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am accusing you of having "wrong standards." High standards are going to vary from one place to another. I bet if we talked about how you dress going to games those standards would vary greatly across the country.

Peace

You are probably right on that also, are you pressing your Nike sweatsuit for your next game?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

You are probably right on that also, are you pressing your Nike sweatsuit for your next game?

Actually I wear suits and very nice slacks (when working varsity night games). Most of the time I do not wear a tie, but I will wear polo style shirts with an association name on it or something related to officiating or basketball officiating on it. If I ever wear jeans (which is almost never), I do so when all my other pants are at the cleaners. I can tell you I am largely the best dressed official around. Now those were the standards I came up with and were taught, but I do not challenge anyone's professionalism because I do something different or have a different standard.

Peace

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Actually I wear suits and very nice slacks (when working varsity night games). Most of the time I do not wear a tie, but I will wear polo style shirts with an association name on it or something related to officiating or basketball officiating on it. If I ever wear jeans (which is almost never), I do so when all my other pants are at the cleaners. I can tell you I am largely the best dressed official around. Now those were the standards I came up with and were taught, but I do not challenge anyone's professionalism because I do something different or have a different standard.

Peace

Thanks, I hope you knew the Nike Sweatsuit shot was not serious.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

Thanks, I hope you knew the Nike Sweatsuit shot was not serious.

I did not take it seriously at all. I just wanted you to know that all standards do not apply when you think they should.

Peace

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I did not take it seriously at all. I just wanted you to know that all standards do not apply when you think they should.

Peace

They apply in the world "I" live in, and that is the only world I am concerned with.

[Ref_ Fred]

Guys why does it matter, It's open book this year so why would anyone want it in advance? Just read the book!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

Guys why does it matter, It's open book this year so why would anyone want it in advance? Just read the book!

Oh, is it open book in all 50 states, Fred?

Just wondering....

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am accusing you of having "wrong standards." High standards are going to vary from one place to another. I bet if we talked about how you dress going to games those standards would vary greatly across the country.

Peace

How someone dresses vs. taking a test are apples and oranges. They may both standards but of a different nature.

Underdressing is not unethical. Perhaps unprofessional, but not unethical. Plus the manner of dress says absolutely nothing about the ability or character of the person.

Submitting answers to a test obtained in a manner not in line with the intentions of the testing body is unethical...its cheating. For example, If the organization administering the tests expects to hand out the test and have it's members take it on the spot, it would be unethical for any of those members to obtain the test or its answers prior to that time. It would also be unethical for someone to knowingly provide such a person with the test or its answers.

These principles are not variable or subjective. They are the basic to the definitions or honor and integrity.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Submitting answers to a test obtained in a manner not in line with the intentions of the testing body is unethical...its cheating. For example, If the organization administering the tests expects to hand out the test and have it's members take it on the spot, it would be unethical for any of those members to obtain the test or its answers prior to that time. It would also be unethical for someone to knowingly provide such a person with the test or its answers.

These principles are not variable or subjective. They are the basic to the definitions of honor and integrity.

Well said.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

How someone dresses vs. taking a test are apples and oranges. They may both standards but of a different nature.

Underdressing is not unethical. Perhaps unprofessional, but not unethical. Plus the manner of dress says absolutely nothing about the ability or character of the person.

I did not say anything about how you dress as being unethical. I only talked about dress in the context of how things will vary based on where you live and the level you are working. When I work college games it is expected that we wear suits and much more than we do at the HS level. And at the college level Hank Nichols made it clear it was OK for those to take the NCAA test with people "sitting right next to you at your computer, I do not care." So let us relax on what is "unethical" when the standards are not always the same across the board.

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Submitting answers to a test obtained in a manner not in line with the intentions of the testing body is unethical...its cheating. For example, If the organization administering the tests expects to hand out the test and have it's members take it on the spot, it would be unethical for any of those members to obtain the test or its answers prior to that time. It would also be unethical for someone to knowingly provide such a person with the test or its answers.

The testing body for most of us is the state or local association that you belong to. It is not the NF. The NF produces a test and each state choice to use it how they see fit. There are states that make their own test for qualification purposes. How can someone be unethical in getting a copy or giving out a copy of a test their state does not even use?

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

These principles are not variable or subjective. They are the basic to the definitions or honor and integrity.

They are very subjective and variable in many ways. We are just going to have to disagree on this one (what else is new). Until you can show me in the code of ethics there is something specific to the test, then it is very subjective what rules apply to a test.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The testing body for most of us is the state or local association that you belong to. It is not the NF. The NF produces a test and each state choice to use it how they see fit. There are states that make their own test for qualification purposes. How can someone be unethical in getting a copy or giving out a copy of a test their state does not even use?

They are very subjective and variable in many ways. We are just going to have to disagree on this one (what else is new). Until you can show me in the code of ethics there is something specific to the test, then it is very subjective what rules apply to a test.

How about getting the test early that the state actually does use? Let's take Alaska,for example...the home of Whistles&Stripes.

Alaska uses the exact same NFHS exam that ol' W&S has been looking for since mid-September. The ASAA sends the exam and the blank answer sheet to each official, and then that completed answer sheet has to be mailed in. The ASAA then marks the exam and sends the mark and sheet back to each official. A passing grade for certification is 75%, but you can't work state tournaments without being certified.

As for the "Code of Ethics", the following is posted on the appropriate ASAA web page--- "Tests are NOT released prior to the NFHS release date". Of course, that doesn't apply to ol' W&S getting the test e-mailed to him. Naw.....

http://www.asaa.org/officials/index.html

I'll let you know shortly when Alaska actually mails the test out(mid-September, Bush? ) and when they expect it back. I've asked for that info.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

How about getting the test early that the state actually does use? Let's take Alaska,for example...the home of Whistles&Stripes.

Alaska uses the exact same NFHS exam that ol' W&S has been looking for since mid-September. The ASAA sends the exam and the blank answer sheet to each official, and then that completed answer sheet has to be mailed in. The ASAA then marks the exam and sends the mark and sheet back to each official. A passing grade for certification is 75%, but you can't work state tournaments without being certified.

As for the "Code of Ethics", the following is posted on the appropriate ASAA web page--- "Tests are NOT released prior to the NFHS release date". Of course, that doesn't apply to ol' W&S getting the test e-mailed to him. Naw.....

http://www.asaa.org/officials/index.html

I'll let you know shortly when Alaska actually mails the test out(mid-September, Bush? ) and when they expect it back. I've asked for that info.

I do not live in Alaska, I do not care what Alaska says. That is something Alaska is going to have to deal with. For the record I have not given out the test and I live in Illinois and there is no such mandate. The test is made public to us online and this year it came out before my birthday in late September.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

1) That is something Alaska is going to have to deal with.

2) For the record I have not given out the test and I live in Illinois and there is no such mandate. The test is made public to us online and this year it came out before my birthday in late September.

1) Agree.

2) A better choice of words might be "private to you online". The test is passwod-protected, isn't it? That means that the exam is not meant or intended for the general public, and it is also not available to the general public (including officials from other states) through the IHSA web site. As for the "mandate", I'm also quite sure that the IHSA never intended for Illinois officials to send that exam out to officials in 49 other states that might not have written the exact same NFHS exam in their home state/association yet.