First varsity game..

[blindmanwalking]

Originally Posted by Sirrefalot

Same as previous, newer official 3rd year. My question isn't about rules or interpetations, it about conversing with the coach. Three man I'm the C. right next to the coach. A1 bring ball up court, A2 comes from the block to the wing to set a pick for a1. B2 who is guarding a2 bumps her minor contact i thought but it made the screen move alittle and b1 runs into her. B's coach who is standing next to me says "you got to be kidding, you stood right there and let her throw an illegal screen." I told him politely that it was his player who caused the whole mess, there was no advantaged gain as the ball went out of bounds off of B. Coach B gets upset and starts reciting his unique version of the rule book. Ball changes direction and then quickly back. A1 then dribbles to same wing, and picks up dribble, pivots a few times and then pumps like she is going to pass the ball, however, her pivot foot comes up in the air and she balances on her front foot for about 3 seconds until she finally passes to a team mate. He goes bonkers again, wanting a travel. I explain that it is not a travel until she touchs her pivot foot down with the ball. He again assures me that i do not know the rules. Question is this, how to you converse with a coach who is rating you, who really doesn't know the rules.

Good no-call on the travel. When I first read this I was thinking it was a travel. I looked it up. Casebook 4.43.3 Situation C. Thanks for posting this.

Also, I agree that you can't worry about a coach's ratings. Just call the game and let the chips fall where they may.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

I don't necessarily like this approach. I feel that you should keep your answers brief.

So you disagree with me b/c I said "short" instead of "brief", when I obviously meant "short" as a synonym for "brief"?

I guess if that's the worst critique I get, I'll be pretty happy. Sheesh.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

as long as he stays in the coaches box let him whine.

What exactly is a "coaches box"? It sure isn't in the rulebook. (Small point, but worth remembering.)

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by ChuckElias

when I obviously meant "short" as a synonym for "brief"?

Nope, not gonna do it.

It's over-kill.

[eyezen]

Originally Posted by RonRef

You struck a very touchy cord with me in your last sentence. Why do they let coaches rate officials? Nobody knows this answer not even Jurassic Referee! Most coaches don't know the rules, mechanics or coverage areas. IMO you have to officiate the game and the rating process can never enter into your mind during the game.

That's one area that my state (MO) finally wised up to:

In the 05-06 (and all previous that I've been working) officials handbook we were rated on the following areas:

1) Rules
2) Mechanics
3) Appearance
4) Effort
5) Control
6) Consistency
7) Confidnece
8) Poise
9) Attitude

and according to the 06-07 handbook the areas are:

1) Verbal Communications Skills
2) Appearance
3) Effort
4) Control
5) Consistency
6) Professionalism

so it seems our state at least has readjusted the rated areas to those that concern themselves to the coach/official relationship, which is obviously a good thing.

[Ref_ Fred]

Whining is acceptable?

Maybe to you, not to me. I ain't gonna let a coach whine for very long.

Absolutely, let him whine all he wants. I'll even give him cheese with that whine. As long as they are respectable let him whine. I'll continue to do my job to the best of my ability. You sound like the hitler of basketball officials. I bet you like hearing your whistle becuase it gives you satisfaction. Keep the game flowing, he will realize that whinning is not going to help him coach his team. If he gets out of control ..... Whackkkkkkkk, I've been doing this long enough and have respect of the coaches, administration,and officials. They know my tolerance and how much they will get away with. this comes with time and experience.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

Absolutely, let him whine all he wants. I'll even give him cheese with that whine. As long as they are respectable let him whine. I'll continue to do my job to the best of my ability. You sound like the hitler of basketball officials. I bet you like hearing your whistle becuase it gives you satisfaction. Keep the game flowing, he will realize that whinning is not going to help him coach his team. If he gets out of control ..... Whackkkkkkkk, I've been doing this long enough and have respect of the coaches, administration,and officials. They know my tolerance and how much they will get away with. this comes with time and experience.

OK.....

I sound like a Hitler? Because I disagreed with you? Well, you sound like an official with no balls. But, then again, whatinthehell do I know? I certainly can't have the time and experience that you have, according to your post above, can I? It's six years of officiating time and experience btw, isn't it?

Hey, if you wanna let coaches whine at you continually, be my guest. That's your choice. I don't have to watch you, evaluate or assign you.....which kinda makes me happy too.

[Ref_ Fred]

sound like a Hitler? Well, you sound like an official with no balls. But, what do I know? I certainly can't have the time and experience that you have, according to your post above, can I? It's six years of experience btw, isn't it?

Hey, if you wanna let coaches whine at you continually, be my guest. That's your choice. I don't have to watch you, evaluate or assign you.....which kinda makes me happy too.
Today 12:35pm

My six year may be short in your eyes, but very sucessful. I am respected for my abilities by my peers, and the coaches. Yet your responses to everyone on the Threads has been so far from respectable and encouraging to any new official. Like I said maybe not hitler, but defenitley harsh you certainly have a chip on your shoulder and that may be due to your level of expereince. the only thing I am grateful for is that I don't have to work with you...Now I didn't pick this argument you did by your wise A$$ remarks, not only to me but from what I read to most. If I post it's for constructive remarks, just as the OP did.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

Now I didn't pick this argument you did by your wise A$$ remarks, not only to me but from what I read to most.

Fred, first of all, we're glad you're here on the forum. Nearly everyone's comments here are appreciated. I'm glad for your early success, and that you have the respect of your peers, etc.

Now, please, RELAX.

Jurassic didn't make any smart-@ss comments to you that I can see. He merely said that he doesn't let coaches whine for long. ("Let 'em whine? Not in my games.") Then you called him Hitler. Jurassic's comments about me (all the "short" jokes) are good-natured and long-running. (I may be short, but I run like the wind.)

We're always glad to have new people here and their contributions are valued. But not everyone is going to agree. That's the nature of discussion. Hang out here with us for a while before you decide who the next genocidal dictator is, ok?

[Ref_ Fred]

Chuck,

I can appreciate what you are saying, I guess I take my officiating very seriously. As far as differences of opinion, I agree i think the rules and game are too open and left to ones interpretation, that is why there are differences of opinion. Although, I choose to give creative criticism especially with one who may be brand new on the court. I was very fortunate to have been trained by a very sucessful D1 official and contribute my sucess to him.
I guess I have to lighten up..

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

Chuck,

I can appreciate what you are saying, I guess I take my officiating very seriously. As far as differences of opinion, I agree i think the rules and game are too open and left to ones interpretation, that is why there are differences of opinion. Although, I choose to give creative criticism especially with one who may be brand new on the court. I was very fortunate to have been trained by a very sucessful D1 official and contribute my sucess to him.
I guess I have to lighten up..

Naw, you just have to learn that you've got a lot to learn....even with your immense six years of experience and your great success, as you keep telling us. You might not realize it, being a legend in your own mind already, but imo your previous posts on this forum haven't exactly backed up your own opinion of yourself.

As Chuck said, I didn't make any wise-azz comments to you; I simply disagreed with you. I've got a feeling that I'll probably be disagreeing with you in the future too. Might be a good idea to learn to deal with it.

[Ref_ Fred]

I think you are correct that you and I will probably disagree in the future. I may only have six years, but very proud of it. I wonder what you have???? You say that you are knowledgeable. Anyone can recite rules from a book, can you put them in action? I guess I leave with quote, "We agree to disagree". that's what makes this country a great pace to live

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

I think you are correct that you and I will probably disagree in the future. I may only have six years, but very proud of it. I wonder what you have???? You say that you are knowledgeable. Anyone can recite rules from a book, can you put them in action? I guess I leave with quote, "We agree to disagree". that's what makes this country a great pace to live

No, Fred. I didn't say I was knowledgeable. I didn't say anything in this thread about my experience, resume, success, etc. I'll leave that up to you! I simply gave my opinion.

Lemme make a suggestion to you. Put me on your "Ignore" list. That way you won't have to read any of my posts, or any of my responses to you either. What do you care? You're not here to learn anyway. No need. You already know everything.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by Ref_ Fred

I can appreciate what you are saying, I guess I take my officiating very seriously.

Fred, I'm glad that my words came across the way I intended. As I said, we're always glad to have new folks come here and share and learn with the rest of us.

And you will find that many (if not most) of us also take our officiating very seriously. Very seriously. We've got guys here who have worked multiple HS state championships. (I've only made it as far as the semis.) We've got D1 officials on this board. We've got a guy who worked the NCAA D3 Women's Final Four last year. We've got rules interpreters. And Jurassic, as much of a curmudgeon as he is, is a HS assignor, I believe. So he takes officiating very seriously, you can be sure of that.

So there are a lot of guys here who know what they're talking about. While you have every right to be proud of what you've accomplished, don't make the mistake of thinking that you can't learn from the rest of us.

I was very fortunate to have been trained by a very sucessful D1 official and contribute my sucess to him.

Ok, well, since you're going to be here a while (we all hope), you might as well be introduced to Mr. Annoying Spelling Guy. That happens to be. . . me! Normally, I would consider it a typo, but you did it twice in one sentence. "Success" has two "c"s in it. Just thought you should know.

And while we're at it, you should probably also meet your friendly neighborhood Mr. Annoying Grammar Guy. That happens to be. . . well, what do you know? . . . also me! When you contribute your success to that D1 official, do you get to write it off on your taxes? You probably mean that you attribute it to him/her.

I guess I have to lighten up..

Maybe just a little. But now that JR has growled at you, and you've met the charming Mr. Grammar/Spelling Guy, it should all be smooth sailing from here!!

[Ref_ Fred]

Pleasure to meet you! Thank you for the heads up. there I need some help. Grammar. LOL....