T or no T ??? - Page 2

truerookie · #1 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 01:45pm

[QUOTE=MidMadness]Boys JV game...kid has been crying the whole game about getting fouled practically everytime to the basket. Middle of the 3rd quarter kid goes in, misses layup, turns to me and says when are you going to toot the horn ref???? Perfect spot for a technical or not worth it there??? What do you think??

This is how I would have handle the situation.

It does not matter whether it is a kid or coach. When they are complaining or questioning fouls, violations etc.

Me: "That is the first and last time you get to officiate the game".

This is their warning.

RonRef · #2 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 02:03pm

[QUOTE=truerookie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MidMadness

Boys JV game...kid has been crying the whole game about getting fouled practically everytime to the basket. Middle of the 3rd quarter kid goes in, misses layup, turns to me and says when are you going to toot the horn ref???? Perfect spot for a technical or not worth it there??? What do you think??

This is how I would have handle the situation.

It does not matter whether it is a kid or coach. When they are complaining or questioning fouls, violations etc.

Me: "That is the first and last time you get to officiate the game".

This is their warning.

Truerookie,

"That is the first and last time you get to officiate the game".

This is not an acceptable response, all you need to say is "coach I have had enough" with a stop sign, that is it! We don't need to be sarcastic!

Brad · #3 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 02:27pm

[QUOTE=RonRef]

Quote:

Originally Posted by truerookie

"That is the first and last time you get to officiate the game".

This is not an acceptable response

Completely agree! That is not something appropriate to say to a player or a coach.

This especially does not work with players -- many times if you try to be the "enforcer" they are going to come right back at you.

Instead, take a second during a free throw to talk with the player and say something like, "Hey -- I need your help here... You concentrate on playing and let me take care of the officiating, ok?"

You have to do this in a manner that doesn't embarrass the kid as well. Many times the player will respond in a positive manner -- if he/she doesn't, then you know that you are going to have to handle it in a different manner.

JRutledge · #4 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 03:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad

Completely agree! That is not something appropriate to say to a player or a coach.

This especially does not work with players -- many times if you try to be the "enforcer" they are going to come right back at you.

Instead, take a second during a free throw to talk with the player and say something like, "Hey -- I need your help here... You concentrate on playing and let me take care of the officiating, ok?"

You have to do this in a manner that doesn't embarrass the kid as well. Many times the player will respond in a positive manner -- if he/she doesn't, then you know that you are going to have to handle it in a different manner.

I disagree with this to some extent. Not all kids respond to the same type of comments. I can tell you if you work in some areas and you try to be a "nice guy" they will eat you up and talk back to you even more. This comment was not profane or necessarily confrontational. You are letting the kid know that he needs to play the game and not worry about what you are doing. I tell kids often "This is not the NBA." They get the message and we move on. Of course you have to have the demeanor to pull it off and you have to say it in the right tone. If this comment gets the kid to shut up and play the game that is what we want. We have many tools at are disposal and every tool does not work for every situation. This might work fine under the right circumstances and with the right official.

Peace

rainmaker · #5 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 03:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I disagree with this to some extent. Not all kids respond to the same type of comments. I can tell you if you work in some areas and you try to be a "nice guy" they will eat you up and talk back to you even more. This comment was not profane or necessarily confrontational. You are letting the kid know that he needs to play the game and not worry about what you are doing. I tell kids often "This is not the NBA." They get the message and we move on. Of course you have to have the demeanor to pull it off and you have to say it in the right tone. If this comment gets the kid to shut up and play the game that is what we want. We have many tools at are disposal and every tool does not work for every situation. This might work fine under the right circumstances and with the right official.

Peace

Jeff, you're right that it's important for each ref to size up the situation and the personalities in each game. Sometimes a tough guy style works well, and sometimes it backfires. The same with a nice guy approach. Personally, I find that I can't go too far in one direction or the other, and I try as hard as I can to stay very, very neutral in terms of confrontation and appeasement. But that's just what works for me. In this game, the more styles a ref can use, and the more types of kids she can read well, the better the reffing will be.

Brad · #6 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 03:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I disagree with this to some extent. Not all kids respond to the same type of comments.

Agreed... I guess you have to know your audience. However, I always try a Dale Carnegie approach before a confrontational one.

I'm good at both though

truerookie · #7 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 09:44pm

[QUOTE=Brad][QUOTE=RonRef]

Completely agree! That is not something appropriate to say to a player or a coach.

I do not see eye to eye with you on this one. First, it is ok for me to try and strike a bargain with a player by asking for his help to stop behavior that is unsporting. (Not happening!!) Second, I believe you should set the tone on what is acceptable or not. It will make the game that much funnier for all parties involved.

"Hey -- I need your help here... You concentrate on playing and let me take care of the officiating, ok?"

Is this not similiar to what I stated earlier?

REFVA · #8 (**permalink**) Fri Sep 15, 2006, 08:42am

JMO, the kid may have been whinning, that doesn't mean that a "T" is warranted. although something needed to be said to the kid way in advance. I think with the frustration of his playing and having a bad day. We all blame someone else when things don't go our way.I'm not saying he was right. The better players just keep playing and try harder. It may have been the right time in the 3rd quarter. It could have been the 4th quarter. JMO

I saw the the Mcnabb story, when he was drafted by the eagles and all were booing him at the draft becuase they wanted Ricky William, that made Mcnabb more deteremined to be better not complain. not everyone is a Mcnabb.

truerookie · #9 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 09:30pm

[QUOTE=RonRef]

Quote:

Originally Posted by truerookie

Truerookie,

"That is the first and last time you get to officiate the game".

This is not an acceptable response, all you need to say is "coach I have had enough" with a stop sign, that is it! We don't need to be sarcastic!

I don't believe the comment is sarcastic. I am letting those personnel involved know their behavior will not be tolerated. Bottomline they are trying to influence how the game is officiated.

JRutledge · #10 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 09:48pm

[QUOTE=truerookie]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonRef

I don't believe the comment is sarcastic. I am letting those personnel involved know their behavior will not be tolerated. Bottomline they are trying to influence how the game is officiated.

Even if it is sarcastic, that is not always bad thing. Different situations require different responses.

Peace

truerookie · #11 (**permalink**) Thu Sep 14, 2006, 09:59pm

[QUOTE=JRutledge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by truerookie

Even if it is sarcastic, that is not always bad thing. Different situations require different responses.

Peace

Mr. Rut, that is true and I can live with that.

zeke · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 19, 2006, 07:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MidMadness

Boys JV game...kid has been crying the whole game about getting fouled practically everytime to the basket. Middle of the 3rd quarter kid goes in, misses layup, turns to me and says when are you going to toot the horn ref???? Perfect spot for a technical or not worth it there??? What do you think??

For the record, I t'd him up right there, and it felt great, but I want to make sure you guys felt it merited it. Thanks

U got some great responses. At any level, j.v. to NBA...the first or second time he said something it needed to be address with him with words or a look. u could extend over to the coach but it should never last over to the 3rd. Its almost a you made your bed situation.
Here's a good comment that's professional and makes the point. Number #, here's the deal I'm not going to embarassed u and u r not going to embarass me. I need for u to play and save ur comments otherwise u r going to get me involve in this game. And look him square in the eye. And I may say do we understand each other?
Otherwise, next time--T.
If the coach ask what you said to his player tell him u warn him. He was drawing too much attention to himself.
T's r to help the game. Never show up or get shown up.As long as u r professional your boss can back u up.