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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 08:18am
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Fresh From Camp Tidbits....

I am no expert here....just some things I picked up on....feel free to contribute....

1. Make sure you take your pants just in case. I showed up for my first game at camp and everyone was in pants....not just on my court....EVERYONE. I was in some pretty darn cool under armor shorts.....not good! I didnt fully realize - It's a job interview....dress the part. Actually, it looked to me that about half the guys were wearing NEW pants. Luckily, I tossed a pair of pants in my bag so I was in "uniform" the rest of camp and....had to do a lil laundry.

2. If possible, find out the pet peaves of the camp director. Example, the camp I was at, I learned on day two that the director hated it when guys going from L to T in transition ran up the middle of the court. He also doesnt like it when you bounce the ball on throw ins vs. handing ESPECIALLY with no pressure on the play. You can bet I adjusted those out of my game for the balance of camp.

3. MECHANICS....BY THE BOOK!!!! Ive been to camp....but bottom line, no home made machanics. Only do what is in the book PERIOD. Probably the biggest feedback item I heard all camp to everyone (not just me) was related to mechanics.

4. Attend everything. We had 6 lectutres. There was a sign in sheet at each that was going to be turned in to the director. Even if you can only make half of it due to a game, get in there and sign in. You dont want to be the 2 guys that missed something.

I'm sure I'll think of more and please add to this if you have some.....

Last edited by Larks; Mon Jun 19, 2006 at 02:25pm.
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 09:15am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larks
2. If possible, find out the pet peaves of the camp director. Example, the camp I was at, I learned on day two that the director hated it when guys going from L to T in transition ran up the middle of the court.


3. MECHANICS....BY THE BOOK!!!! Ive been to camp....but bottom line, no home made machanics. Only do what is in the book PERIOD. Probably the biggest feedback item I heard all camp to everyone (not just me) was related to mechanics.
2) That's because if the ball reverses quickly, like on a steal, and you have to go from T to L in a hurry, you aren't gonna be caught in the middle of the play. I'm sure that you and other experienced people know that, Larks, but I just wanted to mention it.

3) No home made mechanics until after you've been hired and also proved yourself. Then it's OK.
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 01:32pm
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Talking Larks, you beat me to it.

Larks,

It was great to finally meet you and see you work. Keep in touch with me offline and I am sure I will see you sometime next year at this camp.

I learned a huge lesson by attending this camp. I learned that I was not as good as I thought I was and I was not as bad as I thought I was either. What I mean by that is I realized everyone at the camp could referee. There probably was not a guy there that could not call the game properly. If I was given the shot I could work D1 ball right now. Now some might say that is a bold statement, but that is not what I say, that is what others say about me and the many other officials that were there as well. Just about everyone there not working D1 could probably work a D1 game if they were just given the opportunity. Now that does not mean I could work Texas/Oklahoma State, but I might be able to work Eastern Illinois/Illinois if I worked with the right partners and the right kind of game took place. All we all need is a shot (said by many D1 Evaluators).

Here are some points I observed as well.

1. Everyone was in shape--If you want to attend a camp like this, you better be in shape. Everyone looked like they could run like the wind or they could take you outside and whoop your behind with ease (in many cases, both). No pot bellies, most officials had the "NBA Look." Also a lot of the officials that work were tall.

2. Almost perfect mechanics across the board--The only thing that might have separated guys were minimal differences. No one was teaching mechanics about where to stand and where you were supposed to be. Everyone understood the mechanics; the evaluators were there to fine tune the mechanics and help us stand out.

3. Show personality--We were told at the very beginning that we need to show we could smile on the court. You need to show you could laugh and show that you were having fun. Coaches might not like what you call, but if you can show you are a good guy, they might not make a big deal over a minor thing.

4. COMMUNICATION---This is probably the most important point made the entire camp. You need to know how to communicate to your partners, coaches, players (AND YES) and Fans. If you could not communicate to these people, you will not be a successful official period. You have to be able to tell a coach what happen on a play. You have to be able to talk to your partners or give signals that make it clear what you called and what you need to look for in the game. You need show confidence when you make calls to the public (fans) and not cause total confusion when you make a call. You need to know how to get players on your side or get them to understand what you want to accomplish. THIS WAS THE MOST COMMON AND IMPORTANT POINT MADE THE ENTIRE CAMP BY MANY EVALUATORS AND OFFICIALS!!!!

5. There were about 85 officials at this camp. Eighty-three could work D1 if they just got a shot yesterday. There were very minimal factors that separated the top guy from the last guy. Everyone hustled, everyone had great mechanics. This was not a camp where evaluators had to teach things like "This is the Lead official and this is the Trail official."

6. Ball first, contact second--I only say this because I get ripped apart for saying this. There was a play that a current D1 official was working. There was a hard move to the basket and a defender came behind and made a block against the backboard. There was a little contact with the shooter by the defender but no one falls to the ground. The official called a foul. One of the evaluators asked him about this play he said, "Did he get the ball first or contact came first?" The officials said, "He clearly got the ball first, but he put his knee into the guys side and I thought that was a foul." The evaluator said, "That is a play-though. Unless he knocks him into the 10th row and even then, you have to let that go. He made a block, let the rest go." I say this because the evaluator leaves no where near me, has never met me and works a hefty D1 schedule and has been doing so for over 20 years. I have been ripped time and time again, but at the college level, a clean block you rule the rest incidental contact for the most part.

There are so many other things I could mention, but these were the most important I could think of. Great experience. I learned a lot. I hope to see more from here next year.

Peace
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 02:10pm
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Location: Indianapolis, IN
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This might be a dumb question, but who plays in these official's camp games?

I was just curious. Do they run these Ref Camps side by side with camps for HS kids? One side being the Ref Camp the other being the Player's Camp.

Or do they bring in teams to play specifically to let the refs practice and be evaluated?
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 02:23pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grizwald
This might be a dumb question, but who plays in these official's camp games?

I was just curious. Do they run these Ref Camps side by side with camps for HS kids? One side being the Ref Camp the other being the Player's Camp.

Or do they bring in teams to play specifically to let the refs practice and be evaluated?
Most of the time the officials' camps are run in conjunction with HS players and team camps. There may be a few isolated instances where teams and players are brought in for the officials, but most of the camps I've been associated are run where the assingnor supplies some or all of the officials to a team camp, and uses that opportunity to view and critique.
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 02:24pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grizwald
This might be a dumb question, but who plays in these official's camp games?

I was just curious. Do they run these Ref Camps side by side with camps for HS kids? One side being the Ref Camp the other being the Player's Camp.

Or do they bring in teams to play specifically to let the refs practice and be evaluated?
I think it would depend on the camp. Most times it is a bunch of HS teams come to a college so they can be seen and the schools can build relationships with college programs and the coaching staffs can build a relationship with future prospective players. This camp was a "team camp." A lot of the teams were in the area or in some surrounding states for the weekend. Every team had a coach or two and most of the time they left us the hell alone. The teams were there to get playing time and to get better by playing good competition.

Peace
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 02:33pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
4. COMMUNICATION---This is probably the most important point made the entire camp. You need to know how to communicate to your partners, coaches, players (AND YES) and Fans. If you could not communicate to these people, you will not be a successful official period. You have to be able to tell a coach what happen on a play. You have to be able to talk to your partners or give signals that make it clear what you called and what you need to look for in the game. You need show confidence when you make calls to the public (fans) and not cause total confusion when you make a call. You need to know how to get players on your side or get them to understand what you want to accomplish. THIS WAS THE MOST COMMON AND IMPORTANT POINT MADE THE ENTIRE CAMP BY MANY EVALUATORS AND OFFICIALS!!!!

Oh yeah....great one Rut (nice to meet you too by the way)......

4a. Communication on Fouls...

Signal the foul
Say the color and number of the offender
Indicate who the shooter is

BEFORE YOU GO TO THE TABLE

Believe it or not, one of the clinicians drilled this one several times. We've all heard it before but how many of us consistently do it? Obviously they want this to happen so....when in Rome...
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Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 03:28pm
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What camp was this?
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jun 19, 2006, 03:30pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
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Dale Kelley Camp

At Western Kentucky University.

Peace
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 02:55pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
Larks,

It was great to finally meet you and see you work. Keep in touch with me offline and I am sure I will see you sometime next year at this camp.

I learned a huge lesson by attending this camp. I learned that I was not as good as I thought I was and I was not as bad as I thought I was either. What I mean by that is I realized everyone at the camp could referee. There probably was not a guy there that could not call the game properly. If I was given the shot I could work D1 ball right now. Now some might say that is a bold statement, but that is not what I say, that is what others say about me and the many other officials that were there as well. Just about everyone there not working D1 could probably work a D1 game if they were just given the opportunity. Now that does not mean I could work Texas/Oklahoma State, but I might be able to work Eastern Illinois/Illinois if I worked with the right partners and the right kind of game took place. All we all need is a shot (said by many D1 Evaluators).

Here are some points I observed as well.

1. Everyone was in shape--If you want to attend a camp like this, you better be in shape. Everyone looked like they could run like the wind or they could take you outside and whoop your behind with ease (in many cases, both). No pot bellies, most officials had the "NBA Look." Also a lot of the officials that work were tall.

2. Almost perfect mechanics across the board--The only thing that might have separated guys were minimal differences. No one was teaching mechanics about where to stand and where you were supposed to be. Everyone understood the mechanics; the evaluators were there to fine tune the mechanics and help us stand out.

3. Show personality--We were told at the very beginning that we need to show we could smile on the court. You need to show you could laugh and show that you were having fun. Coaches might not like what you call, but if you can show you are a good guy, they might not make a big deal over a minor thing.

4. COMMUNICATION---This is probably the most important point made the entire camp. You need to know how to communicate to your partners, coaches, players (AND YES) and Fans. If you could not communicate to these people, you will not be a successful official period. You have to be able to tell a coach what happen on a play. You have to be able to talk to your partners or give signals that make it clear what you called and what you need to look for in the game. You need show confidence when you make calls to the public (fans) and not cause total confusion when you make a call. You need to know how to get players on your side or get them to understand what you want to accomplish. THIS WAS THE MOST COMMON AND IMPORTANT POINT MADE THE ENTIRE CAMP BY MANY EVALUATORS AND OFFICIALS!!!!

5. There were about 85 officials at this camp. Eighty-three could work D1 if they just got a shot yesterday. There were very minimal factors that separated the top guy from the last guy. Everyone hustled, everyone had great mechanics. This was not a camp where evaluators had to teach things like "This is the Lead official and this is the Trail official."

6. Ball first, contact second--I only say this because I get ripped apart for saying this. There was a play that a current D1 official was working. There was a hard move to the basket and a defender came behind and made a block against the backboard. There was a little contact with the shooter by the defender but no one falls to the ground. The official called a foul. One of the evaluators asked him about this play he said, "Did he get the ball first or contact came first?" The officials said, "He clearly got the ball first, but he put his knee into the guys side and I thought that was a foul." The evaluator said, "That is a play-though. Unless he knocks him into the 10th row and even then, you have to let that go. He made a block, let the rest go." I say this because the evaluator leaves no where near me, has never met me and works a hefty D1 schedule and has been doing so for over 20 years. I have been ripped time and time again, but at the college level, a clean block you rule the rest incidental contact for the most part.

There are so many other things I could mention, but these were the most important I could think of. Great experience. I learned a lot. I hope to see more from here next year.

Peace
Hey Rut,

I was at a local camps this weekend and I had the same play just about. It was a shot block then contact and I passed on the foul. My partner came all the way in my area and called the foul and the coach hit the roof. I couldnt agree more that contact after a shot block is deemed incidental!
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 03:05pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IREFU2
Hey Rut,

I was at a local camps this weekend and I had the same play just about. It was a shot block then contact and I passed on the foul. My partner came all the way in my area and called the foul and the coach hit the roof. I couldnt agree more that contact after a shot block is deemed incidental!
You might agree with this, but there are a lot of people here that do not agree on this website. I really do not care either way. I just wanted to point out that another official with much more experience than I have and works a level I might never achieve told officials what they have to do on a play like this. And he used the same language I have been using for years when talking about this play. I was accused of not knowing what I was talking about and making it up. Just goes to show that officiating is about philosophies and fitting into those philosophies.

Peace
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 03:09pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
You might agree with this, but there are a lot of people here that do not agree on this website. I really do not care either way. I just wanted to point out that another official with much more experience than I have and works a level I might never achieve told officials what they have to do on a play like this. And he used the same language I have been using for years when talking about this play. I was accused of not knowing what I was talking about and making it up. Just goes to show that officiating is about philosophies and fitting into those philosophies.

Peace
Yeah, I know the feeling. But after watching March Madness this past year, it was clear that contact after the block shot is incidental. At Bob Gibbons, we were told to leave the Ticky Tac fouls alone and call only the obvious.
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 03:14pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IREFU2
Yeah, I know the feeling. But after watching March Madness this past year, it was clear that contact after the block shot is incidental. At Bob Gibbons, we were told to leave the Ticky Tac fouls alone and call only the obvious.
You did not have to watch the post season, you could watch the regular season and come to that conclusion too. You just do not see this called a foul very often if at all at the Men's College level. I cannot tell you what is acceptable in Women's basketball. I just learned in the past two camps I have attended that Women's and NBA basketball was not seen in a very positive light.

Peace
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 03:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge
You did not have to watch the post season, you could watch the regular season and come to that conclusion too. You just do not see this called a foul very often if at all at the Men's College level. I cannot tell you what is acceptable in Women's basketball. I just learned in the past two camps I have attended that Women's and NBA basketball was not seen in a very positive light.

Peace
Well, I once was going to the women side to see if I could get in and its actually harder.
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Old Tue Jun 20, 2006, 03:33pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IREFU2
Hey Rut,

I was at a local camps this weekend and I had the same play just about. It was a shot block then contact and I passed on the foul. My partner came all the way in my area and called the foul and the coach hit the roof. I couldnt agree more that contact after a shot block is deemed incidental!
It all depends on who's watching. I had that play also as the lead. Trail came in (with a late whistle) and made the call. At the next time-out he came in and asked why Slot and I passed on foul. Slot said he didn't see any contact and only contact I saw I thought was incidental. After the game, the 2 big dawgs watching on the side praised the trail for coming in with the late whistle. Apparently there was more contact than I saw from my angle.

BTW, IREFU2 and I were at the same camp.
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