Weird Play in AAU Game tonight

[IREFU2]

I had a weird play happen tonight and was wondering if I did the thing. A1 is on the free throw line for one and one. He bounces the ball in the lane (kind of does that spin thing to make it come back to him) and the ball stops dead in the middle of the lane. B1 reaches in the lane and grabs the ball. I immediately call a violation on B1 for touching ball. I give A1 another chance at the one and one. Was that the correct way of handling this? I have never had this happen before.

[Snake~eyes]

Sounds like the freethrower lost the ball? Just blow the whistle and readminister the throw-in. Essentially the same outcome but I would not have called a violation.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

I had a weird play happen tonight and was wondering if I did the thing. A1 is on the free throw line for one and one. He bounces the ball in the lane (kind of does that spin thing to make it come back to him) and the ball stops dead in the middle of the lane. B1 reaches in the lane and grabs the ball. I immediately call a violation on B1 for touching ball. I give A1 another chance at the one and one. Was that the correct way of handling this? I have never had this happen before.

If you are using NFHS rules then you didn't handle it precisely right, but close enough.
There is a case play (9.1.1 see below) which instructs you to whistle immediately to prevent any lane violations when the ball accidently gets away from the shooter.
So you should have just hit the whislte and readministered the front end of the one and one.

Now it sounds like you did that, but you state that you called a lane violation on B1. Since that is the case, you should have been indicating a delayed violation during the replacement FT and if it was missed, then the shooter gets another try. I seriously doubt that you did this, so you got the right administration for the wrong reason.

Here's the case play:
FREE-THROWER LOSES BALL
9.1.1 SITUATION: A1, at the free throw line to attempt a free throw (a) muffs the pass from the official and it rolls forward; or (b) accidentally drops the ball before the throwing motion is started. RULING: In (a) and (b) the official should sound the whistle to prevent any violations and then start the free throw procedure again.

[IREFU2]

But, he didnt actually loose the ball. He was showing off and trying to look cool by tossing the ball out into the lane with a back spin on it. So it was actually his fault.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

But, he didnt actually loose the ball. He was showing off and trying to look cool by tossing the ball out into the lane with a back spin on it. So it was actually his fault.

Yeah, he was "showing off." Yeah, he lost the handle. He looks a little stupid. That's punishment enough. The best thing you can do, is just follow the case play and get play going again. The worst thing you can do is draw unwarranted and unwanted attention to yourself by making any call based on the notion that he was "showing off" and "it was actually his fault."

[Adam]

There isn't a lot of showing off here, to be honest. The back spin dribble is common before a free throw; a lot of players use it to focus and get into rythm. Unless he threw it unreasonably far, it's not really showing off. Even if he did throw it unreasonably far; give it back to him.
If you want to make a point to him, just smile and shake your head while you give it back.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Now it sounds like you did that, but you state that you called a lane violation on B1. Since that is the case, you should have been indicating a delayed violation during the replacement FT and if it was missed, then the shooter gets another try. I seriously doubt that you did this, so you got the right administration for the wrong reason.

You're right Nevada, outcome was correct but IREF's interpretation was wrong. A couple of us VA refs spoke with him about this yesterday and I think he has seen the error of his ways.

[daveg144]

I had almost exactly the same thing happen Saturday night. Kid fumbled the ball while dribbling at the line before shooting the first of two shots. He looked over at me (I was trail) and I motioned for him to pick up the ball and start over. He missed the first and made the second. Opposing coach was asking why we didn't call a violation. I told him it wasn't a violation, the kid just fumbled the ball. He gave me a look but said nothing more.

More importantly, where do they get some of these AAU coaches? So many of them have no clue as to the rules and they whine and complain about almost every call (or no call). You can't reason with them because they know EVERYTHING (and we don't know ANYTHING). It is fun to whack them and make them sit down.

[SeanFitzRef]

Originally Posted by daveg144

More importantly, where do they get some of these AAU coaches? So many of them have no clue as to the rules and they whine and complain about almost every call (or no call). You can't reason with them because they know EVERYTHING (and we don't know ANYTHING). It is fun to whack them and make them sit down.

AAU = Amatuer A$&H@!# United!!!

Most of the coaches on the AAU circuit are wannabes at best, street agents or guys that are trying to make a mark. Some programs have actual coaches that work with the kids to improve their game. Others just hire friends of the people that start the AAU program; most of these guys couldn't coach themselves out of an unlocked convertible with the top down, if you know what I mean.

[jkjenning]

Hey SeanFitzRef and daveg144, it would be better to think of these AAU coaches in a more respectful manner. When a coach steps up to fill a spot and does not have the qualifications you would like, just assume that the coach has a desire to see the kids compete; also assume that there were hours off the court that the coach has dedicated, without pay, to working with the kids; in contrast, we show up for an hour to call the game and get paid. Find some respect.

[All_Heart]

Originally Posted by daveg144

It is fun to whack them and make them sit down.

Just a reminder that AAU plays with college rules (at least in my area) and that sitting the coach after a technical is a high school rule. This is an FYI so that you don't misapply this rule with a coach that knows the rule (for those 1% that know the rules )

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by All_Heart

Just a reminder that AAU plays with college rules (at least in my area) and that sitting the coach after a technical is a high school rule. This is an FYI so that you don't misapply this rule with a coach that knows the rule (for those 1% that know the rules )

That's a regional thing. We use FED rules here for AAU.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by All_Heart

Just a reminder that AAU plays with college rules (at least in my area) and that sitting the coach after a technical is a high school rule. This is an FYI so that you don't misapply this rule with a coach that knows the rule (for those 1% that know the rules )

Not here. Any AAU tourney we have are NFHS rules. If the coach wants to argue it, I can easily issue a second T and then the issue is moot. Plus I have only heard that the girls games use the NCAA rules at the regional events and up. Do the boys do this too?