WARNING!! Annual Off-Topic Baseball Thread. Esteemed Members BEWARE!!

[tjones1]

And besides... what on earth do the Cubs have that the Yankees would want?!

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by tjones1

And besides... what on earth do the Cubs have that the Yankees would want?!

Good question.

Peace

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by tjones1

And besides... what on earth do the Cubs have that the Yankees would want?!

Better fans.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Better fans.

You call fans that go to a game just because the ball park they play in are better fans?

Peace

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You call fans that go to a game just because the ball park they play in are better fans?

Better fans than the ones in NY that go to a game just to yell, "Hey, _______, you suck!"?

Yep.

Where were the all the White Sox fans before 2005? In fact, weren't there games not sold out at the Cell late in the season last year? According to ESPN.com, the Cubs still averaged more than 2,500 per game more than the White Sox in 2006. And they averaged almost 10,000 fans more per game in the year the White Sox won the World Series. And it isn't because Wrigley holds more than the Cell. And it certainly isn't because it's easier to get to Wrigley, or easier to park, etc. Sure, it's easy to be a fan when your team's winning. So what does that say about White Sox fans?

I will give St. Louis fans their due. They seem to have a good reputation of support, although I would like to see how their support would stay if they had the same record as the Cubs. However, they're trying - there are a few members of this forum ..ahem...tjones1... who can practically say they have not seen the Cardinals win a W.S. in their lifetime.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

However, they're trying - there are a few members of this forum ..ahem...tjones1... who can practically say they have not seen the Cardinals win a W.S. in their lifetime.

Hmm, yes, true!

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Better fans than the ones in NY that go to a game just to yell, "Hey, _______, you suck!"?

Yep.

At least the Yankee fans get on their team and manager for the right reasons. Cubs fans get on their manager when most of the players that he is given cannot play part of the season. Also the Yankee fans are used to winning. I expect a little arrogance and bravado.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Where were the all the White Sox fans before 2005? In fact, weren't there games not sold out at the Cell late in the season last year? According to ESPN.com, the Cubs still averaged more than 2,500 per game more than the White Sox in 2006. And they averaged almost 10,000 fans more per game in the year the White Sox won the World Series. And it isn't because Wrigley holds more than the Cell. And it certainly isn't because it's easier to get to Wrigley, or easier to park, etc. Sure, it's easy to be a fan when your team's winning. So what does that say about White Sox fans?

This is why a lot of people hate Cubs fans. You are talking about attendance right now. Now Championships or actual success is not the factor, meaningless attendance numbers are what are key in the bigger picture. I went to a Cubs game about 4 years ago and I was amazed how little anyone was paying attention to the actual game. The only people watching the game and talking baseball were some Cards fans that were sitting behind me. Everyone one else was on the cell phone or concerned about the beer in their hand. The game was not the attraction, the ball park was.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I will give St. Louis fans their due. They seem to have a good reputation of support, although I would like to see how their support would stay if they had the same record as the Cubs. However, they're trying - there are a few members of this forum ..ahem...tjones1... who can practically say they have not seen the Cardinals win a W.S. in their lifetime.

The Cards have had bad years and the fans do not support a team that is terrible. They will support good baseball but not a team that is just bad. Usually the Cardinals are rather successful (considering they have been to about 4 World Series in my lifetime). Just because you show up to a game does not make you a good fan. I live in Chicago and I listen to local radio sports radio all the time and the last thing Cubs fans hold on to is what their attendance figures are. It just makes the point of all those that want a successful team. The Cubs were horrible and the stands were packed for a team that was out of the race since July.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Cubs fans get on their manager when most of the players that he is given cannot play part of the season.

God Himself couldn't have won with the pitching staff that the Cubs G.M. assembled. Hendry wasn't gonna fire himself though, so the Rev. Johnny B. got the boot. That's the way it works, unfortunately.

Baker will end up somewhere. He's a good baseball man.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

God Himself...

Yoohoo...Juulie...

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Baker will end up somewhere. He's a good baseball man.

Yeah, he's good to get fired another 3 or 4 more times before hangin' 'em up.

[M&M Guy]

Ok, here goes:

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Cubs fans get on their manager when most of the players that he is given cannot play part of the season.

I know this fan didn't put the blame on Dusty because of that. I did put the blame on him when I saw players that were playing doing things like not hustling out ground balls, making bad decisions out in the field, being last or next to last in advancing runners and hitting w/runners in scoring position.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Also the Yankee fans are used to winning. I expect a little arrogance and bravado.

I think it's more of a NY attitude, rather than a Yankee fan attitude. According to a friend who watched a game at Yankee Stadium last year, he made the comment about how he wasn't sure he would feel comfortable about taking his daughter there to watch a game, just because of some of the things fans were yelling. Is that an issue everywhere? Perhaps, but he said it was more noticeable there.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This is why a lot of people hate Cubs fans.

Which people are you talking about? White Sox fans? Certainly not people outside the city of Chicago. White Sox fans have always had an inferiority complex when it comes to dealing with Cub fans.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You are talking about attendance right now. Now Championships or actual success is not the factor, meaningless attendance numbers are what are key in the bigger picture.

Meaningless?? The number of people that go to a team's games is meaningless when it comes to determining a fan base? What criteria do you use to determine fan base?

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I went to a Cubs game about 4 years ago and I was amazed how little anyone was paying attention to the actual game. The only people watching the game and talking baseball were some Cards fans that were sitting behind me. Everyone one else was on the cell phone or concerned about the beer in their hand. The game was not the attraction, the ball park was.

How many games have you been to since that particular game? I've been to 5 baseball games this past season - 2 at Wrigley, 1 at the Cell, 1 in Cleveland, and 1 in St. Louis. I've noticed that at every game I've been to, so I'm not sure that's a "Wrigley" phenomenon as much as a society issue. There were any number of people talking on cell phones, talking about their job, telling their kids they had enough cotton candy, etc, etc. Heck, in Cleveland there was a group of guys that spent an inning and a half discussing whether Steve Perry from Journey was the greatest rock-n-roll singer ever. Can I extrapolate that Cleveland fans really are the dumber than Cub fans???

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The Cubs were horrible and the stands were packed for a team that was out of the race since July.

Again, I contend anyone can be a fair-weather fan. A real fan supports their team even when the team is horrible. Cub fans show up, buy merchandise, and support the team. How else do you measure how good a team's fans are than during the down years (yea, yea, centuries...)?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I know this fan didn't put the blame on Dusty because of that. I did put the blame on him when I saw players that were playing doing things like not hustling out ground balls, making bad decisions out in the field, being last or next to last in advancing runners and hitting w/runners in scoring position.

I agree with you. Just understand I live in this area and the types of comments I would hear from fans when interviewed or calling into shows, it seemed very fashionable to blame Dusty for damn near everything.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I think it's more of a NY attitude, rather than a Yankee fan attitude. According to a friend who watched a game at Yankee Stadium last year, he made the comment about how he wasn't sure he would feel comfortable about taking his daughter there to watch a game, just because of some of the things fans were yelling. Is that an issue everywhere? Perhaps, but he said it was more noticeable there.

I cannot speak for everywhere. I have not attended many pro baseball games in my lifetime. You are probably right.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Which people are you talking about? White Sox fans? Certainly not people outside the city of Chicago. White Sox fans have always had an inferiority complex when it comes to dealing with Cub fans.

I am a Cards fans. It is not like my only experience is what goes on here. Even Cards fans across the state think Cubs fans are more concerned with the tourist attraction called Wrigley Field.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Meaningless?? The number of people that go to a team's games is meaningless when it comes to determining a fan base? What criteria do you use to determine fan base?

Fans can watch games at home too. How many people attend the games is not a direct reflection on the fan base. That just shows who is going to spend money. If my team was terrible and not doing what I think is best for the team, I would not give them money until they show some signs of effort to make the team better. I hear fans that do nothing but complain about management and all the decisions and still go to games. If you honestly think the Tribune Company only cares about money that comes into the stadium and you are not winning, why would you spend your hard earned money and keep giving it to them?

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

How many games have you been to since that particular game? I've been to 5 baseball games this past season - 2 at Wrigley, 1 at the Cell, 1 in Cleveland, and 1 in St. Louis. I've noticed that at every game I've been to, so I'm not sure that's a "Wrigley" phenomenon as much as a society issue. There were any number of people talking on cell phones, talking about their job, telling their kids they had enough cotton candy, etc, etc. Heck, in Cleveland there was a group of guys that spent an inning and a half discussing whether Steve Perry from Journey was the greatest rock-n-roll singer ever. Can I extrapolate that Cleveland fans really are the dumber than Cub fans???

Understand I am not a Cubs fan. I am not going to attend Cubs game unless the Cards are in town. The time I went I got free tickets and the game was against the Pirates. I just went because my roommate's cousin wanted to go and I went with him. I have had a couple of other opportunities but it is hard to attend any ball game when you have other things going on. Usually Spring Baseball and Summer Basketball keep me away from any MLB game.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Again, I contend anyone can be a fair-weather fan. A real fan supports their team even when the team is horrible. Cub fans show up, buy merchandise, and support the team. How else do you measure how good a team's fans are than during the down years (yea, yea, centuries...)?

I agree to a point, but most fans when the team is that bad and they are not happy with management do not keep attending games and bad games at that. I guess if you think that makes Cubs fans good fans, you have a right to your opinion.

Peace

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

According to a friend who watched a game at Yankee Stadium last year, he made the comment about how he wasn't sure he would feel comfortable about taking his daughter there to watch a game, just because of some of the things fans were yelling. Is that an issue everywhere? Perhaps, but he said it was more noticeable there.

Well, I was at Yankee Stadium in '04 for a Yankee/Red Sox game. I had those same apprehensions. But I have to be honest, we didn't see any of it. We didn't hear any vulgarity, other than what you'd hear in normal conversation; along with the occasional "_________ suck" chant by fans of each team. And we sat in the center field bleachers, wearing our Red Sox hats. Maybe b/c the Sox got blown out that day, we only heard good-natured ribbing and no hostility or vulgarity. (And one obnoxious call on my cell phone. . .)

I've noticed that at every game I've been to, so I'm not sure that's a "Wrigley" phenomenon as much as a society issue. There were any number of people talking on cell phones, talking about their job, telling their kids they had enough cotton candy, etc, etc. Heck, in Cleveland there was a group of guys that spent an inning and a half discussing whether Steve Perry from Journey was the greatest rock-n-roll singer ever. Can I extrapolate that Cleveland fans really are the dumber than Cub fans???

In fact, I think this is a direct by-product of the pace of the game itself. For better or worse, baseball is not non-stop action, like hockey or basketball. The game lends itself to leisurely conversation and minor distractions. I think that's what made it the "national pastime". When baseball first became popular, I think that's more like what the pace of everyday life was.

As for Steve Perry, well, I've got a couple Journey CD's like any other child of the 80's. But the greatest rock singer ever?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Better fans.

Of course they would be better fans for A-rod.

They won't ever have to watch him play in October.

:shrug: