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-   -   3 seconds.....are you nuts ?? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/23275-3-seconds-you-nuts.html)

Camron Rust Tue Nov 22, 2005 07:25pm
Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by bob jenkins
IMO, as long as the player with the ball is looking at the basket (and I don't mean that literally), I'm not inclined to call a three-second violation, no matter how many times s/he fakes.
And ya know what, so would Chuck, regardless of what he says here.
I really don't think I would. If you're gonna stand in the lane and do 50 headfakes, you're gonna get a whistle. That's always the way I've been taught, and I really believe it. I'm not just arguing for the sake of it. You don't get 7 seconds (2+ in the lane, and then 5 closely-guarded) instead of 3 just b/c you're working on your head-fake.
I'm not even sure I see the original play consuming 5 seconds, but now you've got it up to 7, and the poor SOB has acquired tuorettes, <FONT COLOR=RED>50 headfakes in that 5 seconds (that's 2 headfakes per second for you math illiterates out there).</FONT>
Who you calling math illiterate?

Last time I checked 50 / 2 is 25. ;)

Dan_ref Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:17pm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by bob jenkins
IMO, as long as the player with the ball is looking at the basket (and I don't mean that literally), I'm not inclined to call a three-second violation, no matter how many times s/he fakes.
And ya know what, so would Chuck, regardless of what he says here.
I really don't think I would. If you're gonna stand in the lane and do 50 headfakes, you're gonna get a whistle. That's always the way I've been taught, and I really believe it. I'm not just arguing for the sake of it. You don't get 7 seconds (2+ in the lane, and then 5 closely-guarded) instead of 3 just b/c you're working on your head-fake.
I'm not even sure I see the original play consuming 5 seconds, but now you've got it up to 7, and the poor SOB has acquired tuorettes, <FONT COLOR=RED>50 headfakes in that 5 seconds (that's 2 headfakes per second for you math illiterates out there).</FONT>
Who you calling math illiterate?

Last time I checked 50 / 2 is 25. ;)
Bridge to pettard...one to hoist.

(Or should I say that would be correct in *your* area but in *my* area we do things differently... :p )

Dan_ref Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:20pm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
If A1's making progress and/or trying to get a shot off then he can stay in there forever.
I could not disagree with this more. If A1 is moving to the basket or is about to attempt a try, withhold the whistle. As soon as A1 is no longer attempting a try, it's a violation (assuming that the count has exceeded 3 seconds). If you pull the ball back down for a fake, whistle. If you turn away from the basket for a spin, whistle. That's the way I was taught.
Ya know what?

I don't believe that you watch the lane that closely, hell bent on taking a 3 second violation at the slightest provocation.

I've seen you work, you don't do this.

RookieDude Wed Nov 23, 2005 05:28am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by bob jenkins
IMO, as long as the player with the ball is looking at the basket (and I don't mean that literally), I'm not inclined to call a three-second violation, no matter how many times s/he fakes.
And ya know what, so would Chuck, regardless of what he says here.
I really don't think I would. If you're gonna stand in the lane and do 50 headfakes, you're gonna get a whistle. That's always the way I've been taught, and I really believe it. I'm not just arguing for the sake of it. You don't get 7 seconds (2+ in the lane, and then 5 closely-guarded) instead of 3 just b/c you're working on your head-fake.
I'm not even sure I see the original play consuming 5 seconds, but now you've got it up to 7, and the poor SOB has acquired tuorettes, <FONT COLOR=RED>50 headfakes in that 5 seconds (that's 2 headfakes per second for you math illiterates out there).</FONT>
Who you calling math illiterate?

Last time I checked 50 / 2 is 25. ;)
I think you both got it wrong...
50 headfakes in 5 seconds is 10 headfakes a second...duh!:)

BTW...might as well put in my 2 cents.

50 headfakes gets a 3 second violation whistle from me.
Maybe not on one upfake, I would have to see it, but..."forever in the key"...I don't think so.

Jurassic Referee Wed Nov 23, 2005 07:52am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
[/B]
Bridge to <font color = red>pettard</font>...one to hoist.

[/B][/QUOTE]Tsk, tsk, tsk.....

There is no such word as "pettard".

You obviously meant "petard".

<b>Petard</b>:
- pe-tard
- derived from the French noun- <i>pet</i> or <b>"fart"</b>.
- 1) a small bell-shaped bomb used to breach a gate or wall.
2) a loud firecracker
Word History: The French used <i>petard</i>- <b>"a loud discharge of intestinal gas"</b>- for a kind of infernal engine used for blasting through the gates of a city. To be <b>"hoist by one's own petard"</b> means to blow oneself up with one's own bomb.

So.........

You either wanted to blow yourself up or fart. Which one was it?

Btw, if you put it to a vote, I would hazard a guess that door #1 would win in a landslide.

[Edited by Jurassic Referee on Nov 23rd, 2005 at 07:54 AM]

ChuckElias Wed Nov 23, 2005 08:54am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
I don't believe that you watch the lane that closely, hell bent on taking a 3 second violation at the slightest provocation.

I've seen you work, you don't do this.
You're absolutely right about that. I don't look to make 3-second calls unless I feel I have to. Most of us are like that. But I want to be clear that I disagree with the "he can make as many headfakes/jukes as he wants" philosophy. IF he's in the lane long enough that we've noticed it (which we all agree is going to be more than 3 actual seconds) and then he tries multiple dipsy-doodle moves, we should have a violation. He should not be allowed in the lane for as long as he wants simply b/c a try is coming sometime in the future. The try or move to the basket must be immediate.

jritchie Wed Nov 23, 2005 08:54am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 

[/B][/QUOTE]

Who you calling math illiterate?

Last time I checked 50 / 2 is 25. ;) [/B][/QUOTE]

I think you both got it wrong...
50 headfakes in 5 seconds is 10 headfakes a second...duh!:)
[/B][/QUOTE]

Very good Rookiedude, you have received your bonus points for the day!! :)

Dan_ref Wed Nov 23, 2005 10:14am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
I don't believe that you watch the lane that closely, hell bent on taking a 3 second violation at the slightest provocation.

I've seen you work, you don't do this.
You're absolutely right about that. I don't look to make 3-second calls unless I feel I have to. Most of us are like that. But I want to be clear that I disagree with the "he can make as many headfakes/jukes as he wants" philosophy. IF he's in the lane long enough that we've noticed it (which we all agree is going to be more than 3 actual seconds) and then he tries multiple dipsy-doodle moves, we should have a violation. He should not be allowed in the lane for as long as he wants simply b/c a try is coming sometime in the future. The try or move to the basket must be immediate.
As I recall in this play A1 started at the high post, recieved a pass & drove in after a head fake. He then picked up his dribble, headfaked again & went in for a layup.

No way, now how is this play a 3 second violation.

Camron Rust Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:53pm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Duly noted
 
Quote:
Originally posted by RookieDude
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
Quote:
Originally posted by bob jenkins
IMO, as long as the player with the ball is looking at the basket (and I don't mean that literally), I'm not inclined to call a three-second violation, no matter how many times s/he fakes.
And ya know what, so would Chuck, regardless of what he says here.
I really don't think I would. If you're gonna stand in the lane and do 50 headfakes, you're gonna get a whistle. That's always the way I've been taught, and I really believe it. I'm not just arguing for the sake of it. You don't get 7 seconds (2+ in the lane, and then 5 closely-guarded) instead of 3 just b/c you're working on your head-fake.
I'm not even sure I see the original play consuming 5 seconds, but now you've got it up to 7, and the poor SOB has acquired tuorettes, <FONT COLOR=RED>50 headfakes in that 5 seconds (that's 2 headfakes per second for you math illiterates out there).</FONT>
Who you calling math illiterate?

Last time I checked 50 / 2 is 25. ;)
I think you both got it wrong...
50 headfakes in 5 seconds is 10 headfakes a second...duh!:)

BTW...might as well put in my 2 cents.

50 headfakes gets a 3 second violation whistle from me.
Maybe not on one upfake, I would have to see it, but..."forever in the key"...I don't think so.
Depends on which of the 3 you take as the variable. I took his total and rate as inputs to come up with a time...

50 headfakes at 2 per second takes 25 seconds.

You could also take his total and time and come up with a rate...as you have done.


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