Tricky Timeout Question....

[JosephG678]

Ok, here's one for all of you. I got this tricky question from a coach:

During an interrupted dribble (coach did not use these words, obviously), A1 requests a timeout (I know, the request should NOT be granted, however the offical blew his whistle and some ruling had to be made). Here are the three scenarios I thought of now that play has stopped:

1)Erroneously grant the timeout as in casebook 5.8.3 sit E
2)Inadvertant whistle, go to the AP
3)Call a technical foul on A (thought it would be a team technical) for requesting a time-out when not having team control (assuming this was not an excess time0out)

He said this happened to him in a game and wanted to know how I would handle it.

After a few responses, I will tell you what happened in his game, and what I told him I would do.

I hope this generates some discussion!

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by JosephG678
Ok, here's one for all of you. I got this tricky question from a coach:

During an interrupted dribble (coach did not use these words, obviously), A1 requests a timeout (I know, the request should NOT be granted, however the offical blew his whistle and some ruling had to be made). Here are the three scenarios I thought of now that play has stopped:

1)Erroneously grant the timeout as in casebook 5.8.3 sit E
2)Inadvertant whistle, go to the AP
3)Call a technical foul on A (thought it would be a team technical) for requesting a time-out when not having team control (assuming this was not an excess time0out)

He said this happened to him in a game and wanted to know how I would handle it.

After a few responses, I will tell you what happened in his game, and what I told him I would do.

I hope this generates some discussion!

There's not much to discuss. It's an inadvertant whistle, but once play is stopped you grant the time out. THEN go to AP.

It's not a technical foul for a coach to request a TO when he cant have it.

[Adam]

No T here, ever. Unless you're going to T up a coach for asking for timeout during a looseball situation. You can't T a coach for asking for a timeout when he has one to ask for.

In Fed, the answer is 1 and part of 2. Inadvertent whistle, grant the timeout (you now have a dead ball), and give the ball back to the team who had team control when you blew the whistle.
This isn't an AP situation, either, since A has team control.

I hope the official didn't call the T.

[jr]

you hang the official who called the timeout...

[Nevadaref]

Snaqwells is right, NO AP arrow. There is TEAM CONTROL during an interrupted dribble, so give the ball back to Team A after charging and using the time-out as the case book says.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Nevadaref
Snaqwells is right, NO AP arrow. There is TEAM CONTROL during an interrupted dribble, so give the ball back to Team A after charging and using the time-out as the case book says.

Okay, I see. SO if this was during a shot that was not yet made or missed, or during the rebounding time, THEN you'd use the AP, but not if there's team control. Sheez, another 10 or 15 years, and I"m gonna be really good at this!

[Adam]

If the shot is missed, I'll go with the AP. If the shot is made, I'm going with the ball to B and an endline throwin. The ball doesn't become dead until the try ends, even on a whistle. Once the ball becomes dead, it's B's ball. I can't justify going AP after a made shot due to an IW.

[JosephG678]

OK, so far this is exactly where I thought this question would lead us...Waiting for a few more replies, then will tell you what happened and what I said...

Thanks.

[JosephG678]

OK, won't keep you in suspense anymore...

The calling official in the coach's game called a technical, despite his partner's telling him he cannot. Coach goes beserk! Didn't affect outcome of the game, but game was close at that point (i.e., 3rd quarter). I told the coach that it was an official's mistake, inadvertant whistle, play resumes with the AP. I realized in the rule book that the timeout gets granted and Snaqwell's extra tidbit about team control during interrupted dribble means team should keep possession and no AP. I realized that if you used the AP, you could actually turn the ball over of the calling team gets it next!

So, again, many thanks to this discussion group!

[Adam]

What level was this?

[JosephG678]

It was in a boys varsity game...Happened earlier in the season...

[Adam]

Wow.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by Snaqwells
If the shot is missed, I'll go with the AP. If the shot is made, I'm going with the ball to B and an endline throwin. The ball doesn't become dead until the try ends, even on a whistle. Once the ball becomes dead, it's B's ball. I can't justify going AP after a made shot due to an IW.

You got it! Case book play 7.5.4 (although a bit unclear because it is not specified that part c is only for an unsuccessful try) as well as the following NFHS interp (which claries the case book play) from this season tells you to do just that.

SITUATION 11: An official sounds his/her whistle accidentally while A1’s try attempt is in flight. The try is (a) unsuccessful or (b) successful. RULING: Even though the whistle has blown, the ball does not become dead until the try ends. The official’s accidental whistle has no effect on the flight of the ball. In (a), since there is no team or player control when the try is unsuccessful, the ball is put in play by the team entitled to the throw-in using the alternating-possession procedure. In (b), score the basket by A1. Even though, by rule, there is no team control during this dead-ball period following the score, the ball would be given to Team B for a throw-in anywhere along the end line. Team B would have clearly received the ball had the official not accidentally sounded his/her whistle. (6-7-5 Exception (1); 7-4-4; 7-5-4; 4-12-3,6)

[JosephG678]

This case only partially applies --> there is no request for a timeout here. In the case example I gave, a time-out was requested. So I guess this case addresses the team control issue but a time-out is still erronously granted. Right?

[Adam]

Once the whistle is blown, grant the timeout. The whistle may have been erroneous, but the timeout no longer is.