|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 11:13am
|
|||
|
|||
Touch call yesterday. I was working a boys and girls high school tournament (my partner and I were doing the girls side) and had a very close game. 3 point difference with 4.8 seconds to play and B1 is fouled with her team in the double bonus situation. (Her team is down by three.) I was trail and doing the silent (hand flick) count on the FT. Her first FT was good although she took about 8 seconds to release the ball on her try. It's now a 2 point game. She receives the ball for her second try and this time takes even longer to shoot. After about 11.5 seconds I finally called a 10 second violation. Her coach came unglued and stood up and started accusing me (VERY LOUDLY) of being connected with the other team. (I am not.) My partner (on lead, bench side) came over and didn't hesitate to T the coach. The coach then loudly accused my partner of the same thing and he was given a second T and ejected from the gym. It was really too bad. The other team shot the FTs for the Ts (missed all four!!) and we gave the ball to A and they just ran the clock out.
I really felt bad for the girls on B, because after the 10 second violation they still might have been able to steal the ball when A was inbounding in B's fontcourt and possibly tie the game. But after their coach's display the girls were so visibly demoralized they just kinda gave up. Amazing thing was that the girl I called the 10 second violation on met me in the parking lot after the game and apologized for her coach!! Any thoughts? 
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 01:25pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
If you had been counting consistently throughout the game (none of the 7 . . . 8 . . . 8 1/2 . . . 9 . . . 9 1/4, etc. stuff) and calling other violations of the ten second rule, then you were in the right and have nothing to worry about.
On the other hand, if other 10 second violations hadn't been called, you should have ignored this one as well.
__________________
"To win the game is great. To play the game is greater. But to love the game is the greatest of all."
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 02:49pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 02:55pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
This could be the dumbest rule in the book. Needs to be deleted.
It very rarely happens and when it does it causes more grief for the officials than any other rule. My count is the slowest you have ever seen!
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 03:02pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Frankly you're right...it COULD be the dumbest rule...but it's still a rule.
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 05:06pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Regardless of the Rule....
This "coach" was TOTALLY wrong in his reaction to the call.
I had a similar situation this year in a Freshman Boys game. I made the call (Intentional Foul: Player made NO attempt for the ball) and the coach went on a verbal tirade. Making accusations of "Cheating" and so on... I calmly attempted to explain what was observed and he continued his ranting and raving..... "T" I go to administer the FTs and the coach starts again... Partner "Whacks" him. I filed the report for his ejection. His AD contacted me and asked for additional info on the situation. He informed me that this incident "opened his eyes" to the unprofessionalism of his Frosh Coach. He checked the score book and found that the coach had been "T'd" numerous other times during the season, but none were double occurances (resulting in ejection). I was suprized that the AD was not aware how pathetic this coach is. He thanked me for the input and assured me that This coach would not have another coaching contract. He said that he viewed the gym as another classroom and he would not tolerate his "teachers" (Coaches) acting that way. I, initially, felt sad that this coach would not be around, but then realized it was all HIS choices that led to the final consequence. Keep your head up! Call as you see them.
__________________
"Stay in the game!"
|
|
Sat Feb 24, 2001, 06:29pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott "You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 02:26am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 06:05am
|
|||
|
|||
|
[QUOTE]Originally posted by rainmaker
Quote:
After the situation took place as I described it at the beginning of this thread, the coach from the losing team addressed the issue with another varsity official who was working the tournament and complained that his team should have received a warning. The official calmly explained that we're not required to give warnings before making a call of this sort. In retrospect I wondered myself if a warning was appropriate given the obscurity of the call, but when I thought about it, couldn't that be construed as showing partiality for the shooting team? (Remember, when the coach blew up he accused me and my partner of favoritism.) Had I stepped toward the shooter after the first try and said, "Hey, you took a long time to release the ball on that first shot, remember you only have 10 seconds." couldn't the OTHER coach have accused me of favoritism and been correct???
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 02:24pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
You probably wont like my post....
I am going to ask the tough question, Is this something that you went looking for? A lot of officials dont do a visible count. Why? because enforcing this rule is looking for trouble and I think you found it. I am not sure that I have ever seen it called. Most of the time officials will do a mental count. If a shot takes too long they will either say something or a coach will ask if it is taking too long. They will speed it up. Although the girl made a mistake by not getting the FT off. She is down 2 and can pull team within one. Maybe some pressure? I dont know if I would have called this...
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 05:48pm
|
|||
|
|||
You're right Kelvin. I don't like the post.
How can you not do the count? It is a part of the rules and a part of the mechanics of the game. To do otherwise makes a travesty of all the rules. We would have refs taking their own spin on the rules. You have to enforce the rules, especially those that deal with conducting the game in an orderly fashion. Coaches are wan to find any loophole in the rules they can to get an advantage, real or otherwise. Enforcing this rule is not looking for trouble. It's doing your job. Every official I have reffed with does the visible count, albeit a bit subdued so as to not disconcert the free thrower. We cannot be concerned so much that a call is going to make a difference that we lose sight of our real purpose for being there. To do otherwise shows favoritism.
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 07:58pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
10 seconds is 10 seconds
It was a proper call, it is the Coach's responsibility to inform his players of the rules. His reaction was to "cover his own ignorance to this responsibility." It is YOUR responsibility (and the coach's, but we know better) to know and enforce the rules consistently, to do anything less is unprofessional.
The only count that is not a visual is the 3-second lane violation. Any questions? Paul: I suggest you re-read your original post. This coach was looking for an alibi for his loss.
__________________
"Stay in the game!"
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 08:42pm
|
|||
|
|||
While rules are rules. Sometimes we need to consider the spirit of the rule. I wasn't there, but could you have pretended something was on the floor to get close enough to the player and let her know she was close to the 10 sec count and to get it off faster on the second shot?
__________________
Make it Fun!
|
|
Sun Feb 25, 2001, 09:36pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Yes, rules are rules....and kevin i for one like your post
One of our biggest jobs in my mind is to let the players determine the outcome of the game. With 4.8 seconds left in the game, any official who makes a 10 second free-throw violation call is in my mind doesn't know what there doing. The rules of basketball are a guide, they arn't black and white. Looking back, why did you wait 11.5 seconds to call the violation,why not at 10 when the rule was first broken? I know your going to give the benefit to the shooter right? Well take it a step further, LET THEM ATTEMPT THE SHOT.! The situation you describe is what make officiating so hard, not what you did but what's going to happen in the future. Mark my words, every time that coach sees another official he will be wanting the 10 second free throw violation called. You've not only set yourself up with the coach you've also set up all your fellow officials. I personally have only called 1 of these violations. It occured when a shooter who had received the ball for the free throw, placed the ball on the free throw line and ran back to their bench. Even then, i gave the shooter at least 15 seconds to put up a shot. By the way it was a forty point ball game and the winning team was at the line. How you dealt with the coach was justified, his actions shouldn't be aloud to displayed, however i again think that your first action of calling the unnecessary violation lead to the bigger problem. The reason i sound so upset is that we have an official in our association that sounds like yourself. He calls an indirect 'T' every time a player runs out of bounds and by out of bounds i mean an inch or two. It just stupid!! Why look for things to call, are there too few?! Anyone can know the rules, but can you understand why the rules have been writen the way they are. Officials must understand the spirit and intent of the rules and not just the words. keep smiling SH
|
|
Mon Feb 26, 2001, 07:44am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
I agree with the idea that this should have been a no-call. At that point in a tightly contested game, it is not the time to pull out the 1st 10 second count that probably either team has had all year. I see no advantage gained here by the offending (unlike ignoring a backcourt 10 sec or a 3 sec count). I would expect a much more egregious violation to make this call here. On the other hand, in the 1st quarter, make the call without warning. If it continues, make the call all game, including in this situation.
|
 |
| Bookmarks |
|
|
Linear Mode
