hands in face

[chas]

I was doing a Jr. High girls game last week and during a throw-in(s) a certain girl(she was the only one)would wave and clap her hands as close to the eyes and face of the girl doing the throw in. I will be doing this team again in the future and was wondering if there is a point where her actions are illegal? Would just keeping her hands steady but as close to the face as possible merit a warning? What do you think?

[ChuckElias]

Again, welcome to the forum.

A couple of things may be going on here. First, and most likey, is that the defender is putting her hands across the OOB line. This is a delay of the game. The first offense is a team warning and the second offense is a team technical foul. Don't let the defensive players reach through the OOB boundary until after the throw-in has been released.

The other thing that might be happening is less likely, but I'll mention it anyway. If the defender is holding her hands directly in the inbounder's face, this could be obstructing the vision of the inbounder and is a technical foul charged to the defender.

The easiest way to avoid that technical is to tell the inbounder to back up a little to get some space. If the gym is small and the inbounder physically can't back up, then instruct the defender to back up and don't let her creep back toward the inbounder.

[carldog]

"tell the inbounder to back up a little to get some space"

Telling the inbounder - yes, I know it's girls Jr High in this example - but telling the inbounder to 'back up a little' is also know as c-o-a-c-h-i-n-g.

You are injecting yourself into the game, favoring the offfense in this case. If the court has the required space for the out of bounds player to execute a throw in...make the ball available and just let 'em play.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by carldog
You are injecting yourself into the game, favoring the offfense in this case.

Actually, I'd say you're favoring the defense, since you aren't penalizing for something that's probably illegal, and you're asking the offense to adjust, rather than holding their ground. At the varsity level, I agree with you, Carl. With JH players, no one knows the rules, probably including the coach. If you tell them what's what, and keep them in line, you're just doing your job. I don't call it "injecting myself into the game." I call it, "game managment."

[SamIAm]

Preface-
I don't have a book to quote a rule, and you old timers i am sure are aware of this, and i might be wrong, but here it goes.

There is a provision in the rules for such situations. For the duration of the inbounds play, the OOB lines is temporarily moved in three feet and you back the defender up that same three feet. Low, it is not coaching.

JR or Chuck correct me as neccessary, and quote the rule if you would.

[Back In The Saddle]

Since I happen to have the book handy, will I do for a quote?

1-2-2 If, on an unofficial court, there is less than 3 feet of unobstructed space outside any sideline or end line, a narrow broken line shall be marked on the court parallel with and 3 feet inside that boundary. This restraining line becomes the boundary line during a throw-in on that side or end, as in 7-6. It continues to be the boundary until the ball crosses the line.

[AirForceDude]

Gentlemen
Wouldn't this also fall under the new change for 10-3-7d "Expanded rule pertaining to obstructing an opponent’s vision to include the player with the ball"? There's an article specifically discussing that rule change in the "NFHS Basketball Guide '04-05". In Georgia it was a discussion topic at our rules clinic and my understanding is what you described would be a "T" in our state.

[AirForceDude]

Oops... didn't mean to insult the ladies. Make that "Ladies and Gentlemen"

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by AirForceDude
Gentlemen
Wouldn't this also fall under the new change for 10-3-7d "Expanded rule pertaining to obstructing an opponent’s vision to include the player with the ball"?

Yes, it could fall into that category. I mentioned that as the second and "less likely" scenario in my original post.

And. . .

Welcome to the Forum!

I seem to be typing that a lot the last few days.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by carldog
Telling the inbounder - yes, I know it's girls Jr High in this example - but telling the inbounder to 'back up a little' is also know as c-o-a-c-h-i-n-g.

That might be a valid point, Carl. I've never looked at it that way, personally. Usually, I only mention backing up in two situations. When I am asked during a designated spot throw-in. . .

#1) "Ref, can you make him back up?" My reply is, No, but you can back up.

#2) "Ref, can I move?" I say, you can move back but not side-to-side. (I know that's technically not true, but it's quick and is close enough for the situation.)

I don't think of these replies as coaching. It seems to me that I'm just answering the question. I would not just tell a player where to stand, except maybe during FTs.