Backcourt Violation Magic Spots ...

[BillyMac]

This situation was discussed on the Forum about a few weeks ago.

It came up again last night at an IAABO Refresher Exam study group.

About a dozen and a half guys, including a few good "rules guys", couldn't come up with a consensus answer.

22) The throw-in spot for a backcourt violation is the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throw-in spots to where the violation occurred. Is the official correct?

IAABO answer: “Yes

Citation: 7-5-2

7-5-2: After an out of bounds violation in either the frontcourt or the backcourt by either team as in 9-3, the throwin shall be at the designated spot nearest to where the ball went out of bonds.

9-9 Backcourt Penalty: The opponent is awarded a possession throwin its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation.

IAABO You Make The Call
October 29, 2024

https://plus.refquest.com/videos/vUi...e=sendgrid.com

Commentary

The team in white jerseys gained frontcourt status when White #3 saved the ball near the sideline. She threw it toward the division line, which landed in the backcourt. The ball now had backcourt status, when it was recovered by White #2 standing in the frontcourt.

This was correctly ruled a backcourt violation.

In most cases, a backcourt violation is caused by a player who has backcourt status. When this occurs, the ensuing throw-in should be awarded to the opponents in their frontcourt at the nearest of the four frontcourt designated throw-in spots.

In this case, the violation was caused by a player who had frontcourt status. Since the player had frontcourt status, the ensuing throw-in is a backcourt throw-in at the spot nearest to where the violation occurred.

In this play, the officials correctly awarded the ball in the backcourt along the sideline.

What says the Forum?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

What says the Forum?

I say that as long as you (the generic you) know how and where to administer the FT in the different scenarios, you should stop worrying about the specific answer on the test.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I say that as long as you (the generic you) know how and where to administer the FT in the different scenarios, you should stop worrying about the specific answer on the test.

You are right, but I'm very goal oriented. I've taken this open book exam, with study groups, over forty-three years and have yet to get the answers 100% correct. Close, very close, as close as 99%, but no cigar. Outright mistakes, misreading frontcourt or backcourt, Team A or Team B, that's totally on me. But I hate it when the test question is unfair (not enough information), or the test answer is just damn wrong.

Guys look up to me a "rules guy". I get calls and emails all of the time. A few days ago I got a call from an official during his game!

I'd love to live up to my reputation and get a perfect score.

It's my Great White Whale.

[bob jenkins]

I am confused as to what you are really asking.

If you know the official answer is "yes" and you want a perfect score, answer "yes."

If you already answered "no" and only got a 99, well, sometimes life sucks. Or, see if you can protest the answer.

And, your score and your rules reputation are (probably) two different things. Lots of people here get 100 -- not all of them are rules guys.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

This situation was discussed on the Forum about a few weeks ago.

It came up again last night at an IAABO Refresher Exam study group.

About a dozen and a half guys, including a few good "rules guys", couldn't come up with a consensus answer.

22) The throw-in spot for a backcourt violation is the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throw-in spots to where the violation occurred.Is the official correct?

IAABO answer: “Yes

Citation: 7-5-2

7-5-2: After an out of bounds violation in either the frontcourt or the backcourt by either team as in 9-3, the throwin shall be at the designated spot nearest to where the ball went out of bonds.

9-9 Backcourt Penalty: The opponent is awarded a possession throwin its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation.

IAABO You Make The Call
October 29, 2024

https://plus.refquest.com/videos/vUi...e=sendgrid.com

Commentary

The team in white jerseys gained frontcourt status when White #3 saved the ball near the sideline. She threw it toward the division line, which landed in the backcourt. The ball now had backcourt status, when it was recovered by White #2 standing in the frontcourt.

This was correctly ruled a backcourt violation.

In most cases, a backcourt violation is caused by a player who has backcourt status. When this occurs, the ensuing throw-in should be awarded to the opponents in their frontcourt at the nearest of the four frontcourt designated throw-in spots.

In this case, the violation was caused by a player who had frontcourt status. Since the player had frontcourt status, the ensuing throw-in is a backcourt throw-in at the spot nearest to where the violation occurred.

In this play, the officials correctly awarded the ball in the backcourt along the sideline.

What says the Forum?

It's what I've been saying. Do a history search

And quit sharing your score on your test like it's a status symbol. It doesn't make anybody a rules expert. Knowing the rules on the fly in the heat of a game and doing the right thing make you a rules expert to be looked up to
.

Sent from my SM-S926U using Tapatalk

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

And quit sharing your score on your test like it's a status symbol. It doesn't make anybody a rules expert. Knowing the rules on the fly in the heat of a game and doing the right thing make you a rules expert to be looked up to.

I do not share my score with anybody unless they ask for some reason.

I've known guys that are great officials, calls, game management, etc. who are not rules experts. If I were a coach, I would want them to work my games. I would look forward to them being my partner.

And I've known guys who are rule experts who don't know if the ball is stuffed or inflated. I hated being their partner.

Some can do both. I sat next to one last night. I've worked dozens of games with him over thirty-five years and believed him to be an excellent official. Listening to him explain his rule interpretations last night I realized that he is also a rules "master", even for the weirdest plays one never sees, or only sees a few times in a career.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I am confused as to what you are really asking. If you know the official answer is "yes" and you want a perfect score, answer "yes."

Do I answer with all the IAABO answers and get my first 100% in forty-four years?

Or do I post the answers I really believe in, even if IAABO doesn't agree, and then advocate for my answer as correct?

I'm leaning toward the later.

It was very odd that we received an answer sheet this year at the study group. We usually just get a list of reference citations for the answers.

I don't believe that my conscious would allow me to give the official answer sheet answer if I was positive it was incorrect.

And if I did, I would not consider it a personal 100%.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

22) The throw-in spot for a backcourt violation is the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throw-in spots to where the violation occurred. Is the official correct?

Let's look at a more realistic practical situation, a situation most of us have really seen a few times.

Ball handler A1 is dribbling in his frontcourt very near and parallel to the division line. The dribbled ball strikes the division line, bounces up, and is touched by A1 who is fully standing in his frontcourt.

Backcourt violation.

Where is ball inbounded, in the new backcourt (closest spot to violation), or in the new frontcourt (the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throwin spots to where the violation occurred)?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Let's look at a more realistic practical situation, a situation most of us have really seen a few times.

Ball handler A1 is dribbling in his frontcourt very near and parallel to the division line. The dribbled ball strikes the division line, bounces up, and is touched by A1 who is fully standing in his frontcourt.

Backcourt violation.

Where is ball inbounded, in the new backcourt (closest spot to violation), or in the new frontcourt (the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throwin spots to where the violation occurred)?

In NCAA Men's, stepping on the division line leads to a division line throw and a 30 second shot clock.

When high school went to this rule, I believe my very first post was about the NFHS needing to clarify where they want the throw-in on a back court violation that involves stepping on the division line.

I'm sure based on that post somebody else in the forum came up with a citation.



Sent from my SM-S926U using Tapatalk

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Let's look at a more realistic practical situation, a situation most of us have really seen a few times.

Ball handler A1 is dribbling in his frontcourt very near and parallel to the division line. The dribbled ball strikes the division line, bounces up, and is touched by A1 who is fully standing in his frontcourt.

Backcourt violation.

Where is ball inbounded, in the new backcourt (closest spot to violation), or in the new frontcourt (the nearest of the four designated frontcourt throwin spots to where the violation occurred)?

Ask yourself: Is the violation when the ball hits the division line (inbound at one of the four spots* in B's FC) or when A again touches the ball (inbound at the OOB spot nearest the violation in B's BC)? That will give you the answer you need.

* -- Note the lack of the word "magic" -- there's nothing magic, or even very special, about these spots.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

When high school went to this rule, I believe my very first post was about the NFHS needing to clarify where they want the throw-in on a back court violation that involves stepping on the division line.

2023-24 NFHS Basketball Rules Interpretations
SITUATION 9: A1, while dribbling the ball in team A’s frontcourt, steps on but not over the division line. RULING: Backcourt violation. COMMENT: The ball was in team control in the frontcourt and went to the backcourt when A1 contacted the division line. Team B is awarded a possession throw-in in its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation.

In my most recent situation the ball, not the player, touches the division line.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

... there's nothing magic, or even very special, about these spots.

I coined the term "magic spots" based on a song from my teens, "Magic Bus", recorded by the Who in 1968.

It, surprisingly, caught on in my circle of middle school officials.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Is the violation when the ball hits the division line (inbound at one of the four spots in B's FC) or when A again touches the ball (inbound at the OOB spot nearest the violation in B's BC)?

I have, and it's not a difficult question. That ball can sit on the division line untouched for a ten seconds and not be a violation.

It only becomes a backcourt violation when it's touched by A1 who is fully standing in his frontcourt.

Once decided that it's a backcourt violation, lets look at the penalty:

9-9 Backcourt Penalty: The opponent is awarded a possession throwin its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation.

It's the only penalty listed for backcourt violations.

Is that the correct penalty for this specific situation?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

2023-24 NFHS Basketball Rules Interpretations
SITUATION 9: A1, while dribbling the ball in team A’s frontcourt, steps on but not over the division line. RULING: Backcourt violation. COMMENT: The ball was in team control in the frontcourt and went to the backcourt when A1 contacted the division line. Team B is awarded a possession throw-in in its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation.

In my most recent situation the ball, not the player, touches the division line.

I think that's Situation 10.

Situation 9 is:

SITUATION 9: A1, located in Team A’s frontcourt, passes the ball to A2. The ball strikes the division line and continues to A2, who is also in the frontcourt, without being touched by an opponent. RULING: Backcourt violation. COMMENT: The ball was in team control in the frontcourt and went to the backcourt when it contacted the division line and first touched by Team A. Since the violation occurred in Team A’s frontcourt, Team B is awarded a possession throw-in in its backcourt at the spot nearest the violation. (9-9-1, 9-9 PENALTY)

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I think that's Situation 10.

Thanks bob jenkins.

2023-24 NFHS Basketball Rules Interpretations

SITUATION 8: A1, located in Team A’s frontcourt, passes the ball to A2. The ball strikes the division line and continues to A2, who is also in the frontcourt, without being touched by an opponent. RULING: Backcourt violation. COMMENT: The ball was in team control in the frontcourt and went to the backcourt when it contacted the division line and first touched by Team A. Since the violation occurred in Team A’s frontcourt, Team B is awarded a possession throw-in in its backcourt at the spot nearest the violation. (9-9-1, 9-9 PENALTY)

SITUATION 9: A1, while dribbling the ball in team A’s frontcourt, steps on but not over the division line. RULING: Backcourt violation. COMMENT: The ball was in team control in the frontcourt and went to the backcourt when A1 contacted the division line. Team B is awarded a possession throw-in in its frontcourt at one of the four designated spots nearest the violation. (9-9-1, 9-9 PENALTY)

I can't wait to tell IAABO to put SITUATION 8 in their pipe and smoke it.