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Fun With An Off The Ball Foul
IAABO Make The Call Video
https://storage.googleapis.com/refqu...Xx1LfmXp9e.mp4 Who commits the foul on this play? Observe this play and make a ruling as to which player commits the foul. Four choices: The foul is on White No. 24. The foul is on Blue No. 2. There is no foul on this play. This should be ruled a double foul. My comment: The foul is on Blue No. 2. Blue #2 extends his left arm to prevent White #24 from getting a rebound.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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Where's Waldo ...
If one doesn't catch the first foul, one might end up calling a double foul.
Early IAABO member returns are all over the map with all four answers given. Actually took me a few times through the video to find any foul. Gotta stop ball watching.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Sep 06, 2021 at 04:50pm. |
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I have one foul on this play and it is #24 for grabbing the arm of the opponent and acting like he got pushed. That is a "Fool the referee" play.
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Agree. 24 was the only one fouling.
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Owner/Developer of RefTown.com Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association |
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Quote:
On *this* play -- I have no foul because the ball went OOB, so there was no advantage gained. If the ball had remained live, I have a foul on white for pulling the arm. |
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Cheat Sheet ...
First watched the video without a "cheat sheet".
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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The first foul is on Blue for sticking his hand into White's chest. White then grabs Blue's hand and fakes being fouled again with a headbob.
NBA referees will tell you that when a player boxes out with his back to the basket, he is usually the first one to do something illegal, most often by using their hands or arms to push our hold back their opponent. Get the first foul, not the reaction to the first foul. Lead need to stay as wide as the ball. You don't have to be 2 ft away from action to officiate it. He can officiate the paint while still staying as wide as the ball. Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
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A-hole formerly known as BNR |
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Double Foul ???
Quote:
Quote:
But how "close" do the first foul and reactive contact have to be to consider a double personal foul instead of a single foul? 4-19-8-A: A double personal foul is a situation in which two opponents commit personal fouls against each other at approximately the same time. Technically, the first foul creates a dead ball (the foul not the whistle), meaning that in order for the reactive contact to be a "foul" (and not ignored) it would have to be a dead ball technical intentional foul, or dead ball technical flagrant foul. Can't be a double personal foul since both aren't personal. Can't be a double technical foul because both aren't technical. False double? Ignore the reactive contact because it may not be intentional, or flagrant? Interesting situation, more complicated than I initially thought. Thinking about it too much will eventually give me a headache. Keeping it simple, in a real game, in real time, I'm leaning toward two possible interpretations. In order of preference, single personal foul on Blue #2, or double personal foul on Blue #2 and White #24. That's my story and I'm probably going to stick to it (until I change my mind).
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Sep 07, 2021 at 10:58am. |
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Woman's Prerogative ...
Quote:
This (below) may be the best, and simplest, interpretation: Ball becomes dead. Dead ball reactive contact isn't intentional or flagrant. Personal foul on Blue #2. No bonus. White ball on far sideline. Easy peasy lemon squeezy.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Sep 07, 2021 at 11:48am. |
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Quote:
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Scrum Aftermath ...
Would you consider a double personal foul, maybe not for the initial contact, but for the "scrum" aftermath?
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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Freedom Of Movement ...
Quote:
10-7 A player must not ... impede the progress of an opponent by extending arm(s) ... A player must not use his/her hands on an opponent in any way that inhibits the freedom of movement of the opponent ... A player must not extend the arm(s) fully or partially other than vertically so that freedom of movement of an opponent is hindered when contact with the arms occurs. 2015-16 NFHS Points Of Emphasis Rebounding Any activity to illegally gain rebounding position on an opponent must be properly enforced and penalized. Some examples of illegal rebounding activity are: Extending the arms or elbows to impede the movement of an opponent. Rebounders include each player involved in the act, whether an offensive or defensive player.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) Last edited by BillyMac; Tue Sep 07, 2021 at 11:49am. |
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Quote:
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Billy,
The usage of the term "displacement" is the highlight that nothing influenced the movement or change the direction of the white player (Kind of like saying in the other video the foul was "common" or "normal.") I realize that is not the only reason you call a foul here, but to me the black player did not get a chance to do anything that would warrant a foul. Touching is not a foul. You have to do something as you stated to warrant a foul and the white player was being savvy to try to make it looked like he was being pushed or held in some way. Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael Mick Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Hook And Hold ...
I've heard you Forum college guys use this term before. This certainly turned out to be a hook 'em and hold 'em situation.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16) I was in prison and you came to visit me. (Matthew 25:36) |
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