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  #61 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 07:54am
Courageous When Prudent
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
You're assuming what else he did or did not do in the days before an after the rally. Unless you know something I don't, you can't make any claim that it was more likely from the rally. Maybe he visited a nursing home in NYC.
Again, I'll go back to intellectual integrity. If the most likely answer doesn't fit a certain narrative (usually political), otherwise intelligent people suspend their ingrained powers of logic, reason, and deduction for that particular subject. And I didn't know nursing homes were allowing visitors. That's news to me and the people I know who have had relatives die in nursing homes without any loved ones allowed to visit during the pandemic.
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Last edited by Raymond; Wed Aug 26, 2020 at 10:20am.
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 09:35am
Do not give a damn!!
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
That news to me and the people I know who have had relatives die in nursing homes without any loved ones allowed to visit during the pandemic.
My wife works in nursing homes and it is true that they are off-limits to the public. They have not been allowed to have visitors for months.

Again this is a political position to try to act like they could have got it anywhere when this is not the point. The point is that he took a position that was not much or any threat and he died of the thing that he felt was not a threat. And all we can comment on is what he was doing in a very specific situation where there was no social distancing and no attempt to wear a mask. So to bring this back to sports, the time someone would spend at a rally is similar you would spend at a game. And if it was "full" like the Trump suggested and we have that kind of crowd in close proximity, we can at least at his point say we do not know what might happen if we go totally back to normal.

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  #63 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 04:20pm
Statistician/Ref Hybrid
 
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Today, I learned the primary middle school league for which I officiate fall girls basketball has opted to cancel all fall sports over logistical concerns. There's no word on whether the two adjoining middle school leagues may cancel as well, but I'm suspecting they may also follow suit. So, I have some time until the winter season to prepare and plan.
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Games officiated: 465 Basketball · 73 Softball · 16 Baseball
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 04:55pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Are you calling me useless?

Only if you are correct at two, very specific, times of the day and totally incorrect at all other times of the day.
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 05:19pm
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Autumn Basketball ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stat-Man View Post
There's no word on whether the two adjoining middle school leagues may cancel as well, but I'm suspecting they may also follow suit ...
I often forget that several states have fall interscholastic basketball. If interscholastic basketball is indeed played in your area, please keep us informed regarding COVID modifications (masks, whistle pouches, electronic whistles, rule and mechanics modifications (like the Michigan coin toss), pregame conferences, locker rooms, dressing areas, showers, uniforms and street clothes, etc.).

This may give us a clue about what most of us could expect in the winter.

Be safe.

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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Wed Aug 26, 2020 at 05:34pm.
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 05:24pm
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Alias Smith And Jones ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bucky View Post
... you are correct at two, very specific, times of the day and totally incorrect at all other times of the day.
Why is my ex-wife posting under bucky's username?



Young'uns (and maybe some of the old'uns) can search for Alias Smith and Jones on the Google.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Wed Aug 26, 2020 at 05:29pm.
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 26, 2020, 07:02pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
Again, I'll go back to intellectual integrity. If the most likely answer doesn't fit a certain narrative (usually political), otherwise intelligent people suspend their ingrained powers of logic, reason, and deduction for that particular subject. And I didn't know nursing homes were allowing visitors. That's news to me and the people I know who have had relatives die in nursing homes without any loved ones allowed to visit during the pandemic.
Intellectual integrity suggests you don't just assume it must be what you're prefer the explanation to be without any evidence whatsoever other than conjecture.
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  #68 (permalink)  
Old Thu Aug 27, 2020, 09:39pm
Statistician/Ref Hybrid
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
I often forget that several states have fall interscholastic basketball. If interscholastic basketball is indeed played in your area, please keep us informed regarding COVID modifications (masks, whistle pouches, electronic whistles, rule and mechanics modifications (like the Michigan coin toss), pregame conferences, locker rooms, dressing areas, showers, uniforms and street clothes, etc.).

This may give us a clue about what most of us could expect in the winter.

Be safe.
I imagine the document may change between now and winter, but here are the important provisions for Michigan as of the moment:

There's three different categories of precautions:
Permitted - Completely voluntary.
Suggested - Best practices that should be followed, but not required
Mandated - Required. Officials unwilling or unable to do these cannot officiate.

From your list of items:
Electronic Whistles - Permitted
Masks/Shields - Suggested
Whistle Pouches - Not mentioned, presumably permitted.

Other items:
Permitted - Gloves.

Suggested - Temperature check on game days, BYO beverage, frequent use of hand sanitizer, sanitizing hands after inspecting/touching equipment.

Mandated
  • Arrive dressed in uniform. Putting on the striped shirt after arrival on site is acceptable. Jackets are not required for pregame warmups.
  • Arrive at a single location and time when possible. (aside: good luck with this)
  • Physically distance during the pregame conference.
  • No pregame handshakes, etc with other participants.
  • No contact with players.
  • Physically distancing during conferences with partners. If that's not possible, avoid direct face to face conversation.
  • Only referee and head coaches attend pregame meeting at center circle. (Aside: With the center circle's 6' radius, this is a good idea)
  • Only the referee meets with the table before the game.
  • Officials will not handle basketballs. Players are to retrieve balls that get away from the court area. players will be instructed to leave the basketball on the floor where the next possession will be during timeouts.
Rule/Mechanic Changes:

  • Players may use cloth face coverings without color restrictions.
  • Players may wear gloves.
  • Players may wear long sleeved shirts subject to existing color restrictions.
  • Only the home score/timer are permitted at the table. All others are considered non-essential and must sit elsewhere.
  • No jump balls. Visiting team starts the game with a throw-in at the division line with home team getting the next arrow. Overtimes use a coin toss to determine possession and arrow.
  • Optionally (to be communicated with head coaches if using), Officials will not handle the ball for throw-ins. They will instruct players where the designated spot is (as appropriate) and that the five second count begins when the administering official backs away. For free throws, the lead stands at the end line under the basket and instructs the free-thrower that the count begins when the official back away,
Also, officials are not responsible for teams'/administration's adherence to social distancing, sanitizing, etc. That responsibility lies with coaches and school personnel as appropriate.

Finally, games cancelled due to COVID are deemed cancelled due to an act of God and not subject to a 10-day advance notice. Officials will not be subject to failure to fulfill a contract if they can't officiate because they've been diagnosed with COVID, or a confirmed case of COVID occurs with a team or facility which/where they are schedule to officiate
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Be kind whenever possible. It is always possible." – Dalai Lama

The center of attention as the lead & trail. – me
Games officiated: 465 Basketball · 73 Softball · 16 Baseball

Last edited by Stat-Man; Thu Aug 27, 2020 at 09:44pm.
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  #69 (permalink)  
Old Wed Sep 02, 2020, 02:30pm
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Hot Off The Press ...

From the NFHS:

Having already circulated general COVID-19-related guidance for state associations, the NFHS turned its attention to the sport-specific level. Components that elevated the risk of virus transmission were identified within each of the 17 sports overseen by the NFHS, along with corresponding alteration suggestions for risk reduction.

Under the title “Rules Considerations,” NFHS rules committees devised mitigation strategies for baseball, basketball, competitive cheer (spirit), cross country, field hockey, football, girls gymnastics, ice hockey, boys lacrosse, girls lacrosse, soccer, softball, swimming and diving, track and field, volleyball, water polo and wrestling.

While basic modifications were made to all sports (e.g., sanitizing all scorers’ tables, common areas and shared equipment; prohibiting handshakes and limiting attendance), other sports included proposed changes that were as significant as they were unique.

For example, one of the considerations for basketball was to eliminate the iconic “jump ball” at the beginning of the game. Instead, the visiting team would be given the ball to start the contest, with alternating possessions being awarded for each successive jump ball.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old Wed Sep 02, 2020, 02:48pm
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The Magnolia State ...

From Mississippi:

In support of the Guidance for Opening Up High School Athletics and Activities, the NFHS Basketball Rules Committee offers this document as guidance on how state associations can consider modifications to the NFHS Basketball Rules Book. The modifications outlined in this document are meant to decrease potential exposure to respiratory droplets by encouraging social distancing, limiting participation in administrative tasks to essential personnel and allowing for appropriate protective equipment.

Pregame Protocol
Limit attendees to the referee and the head coach from each team with each coach standing on the center circle on each side of the division line.
All individuals maintain a social distance of 6 feet or greater at the center circle.
Suspend handshakes prior to and following the Pregame Conference.

Team Benches
Social distancing should be practiced when possible. Below are some suggestions.
Limit the number of bench personnel to observe social distancing of 6 feet or greater.
Place team benches opposite the spectator seating.
Additional chairs or rows may be added to allow bench personnel to observe social distancing of 6 feet or greater.
Create separation between the team bench and spectator seating behind the bench.
Limit contact between players when substituting.
Personnel not in the game should adhere to any required local/state face covering requirements.

Officials Table
The host should sanitize the table before the game and at half time.
Place officials table sufficiently away from the sideline to allow for additional space for substitutes.
Limit seats at the table to essential personnel which includes home team scorer and timer with a recommend distance of 6 feet or greater between individuals. Other personnel (visiting scorer, statisticians, media, etc.) may not be deemed essential personnel and consider an alternate location for them.
Table personnel should adhere to any required local/state face covering requirements.

Pre and Post Game Ceremony
Suspend the pregame introduction handshakes.
Suspend post game protocol of shaking hands.

Basketball Rules Interpretations
Basketball given to officials in the locker room, where it is sanitized as recommended by the ball manufacturer and not used for warm-ups.
The host school should ensure that the ball is sanitized during time-outs and between quarters.
Sanitizer should be provided by the host team at the table.
Cloth face coverings are permissible for players.
Consider requiring coaching staff and other bench personnel to wear face coverings while on the bench.
By state association adoption, long-sleeved shirts are permissible.
Officials should not be required to wear jackets during pre-game court/player observation.
Electronic whistles are permissible.
Choose a whistle whose tone will carry inside.
Cloth face coverings are permissible.
Gloves are permissible.
Throw-in: Official may stand 6 feet or greater away from player making the throw-in and bounce the ball to that player on a front court throw-in.
Free Throw Administration: The lead official shall stand on the end line and bounce the ball to the free thrower.
Jump Ball: Eliminate the jump ball and award the ball to the visiting team the first alternating possession for the throw in. To start an overtime period, use a coin toss to determine which team is award.
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old Wed Sep 02, 2020, 10:31pm
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Many of these ideas are only for perception and are frivolous in the bigger picture. If there are viral particles in a gym during a game, they are most certainly going to find some new hosts. Little can be done about that. Short of a vaccine or routine testing (highly unlikely), everyone will be playing basketball roulette.

Also, rules like this won’t survive first contact with personnel, nor the officials who want nothing to do with enforcing them. MLB couldn’t even make it to opening day before players were once again high-fiving, throwing the ball around the infield, and generally eschewing masks in the dugout. And what are the umpires and the commissioner’s office doing about it? Absolutely nothing.


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  #72 (permalink)  
Old Thu Sep 03, 2020, 08:49am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crosscountry55 View Post
Many of these ideas are only for perception and are frivolous in the bigger picture. If there are viral particles in a gym during a game, they are most certainly going to find some new hosts. Little can be done about that. Short of a vaccine or routine testing (highly unlikely), everyone will be playing basketball roulette.

Also, rules like this won’t survive first contact with personnel, nor the officials who want nothing to do with enforcing them. MLB couldn’t even make it to opening day before players were once again high-fiving, throwing the ball around the infield, and generally eschewing masks in the dugout. And what are the umpires and the commissioner’s office doing about it? Absolutely nothing.


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Yep. It's to make it look like they are doing something that will help.

And didn't the CDC come out and say that there is no evidence that the virus is transmitted via surfaces?
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old Thu Sep 03, 2020, 09:57am
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Stopping The Tide ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
It's to make it look like they are doing something that will help.
It’s like King Canute trying to stop the tide.

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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old Sat Sep 05, 2020, 01:45pm
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The Constitution State ...

Latest news from Connecticut Interscholastic Athletic Conference (the state interscholastic sports governing body) regarding fall sports.

The CIAC had come up with more "relaxed" ideas but ended up following the more restrictive State Department of Public Health standards (some towns/cities/schools were already planning to unilaterally follow the stricter State Department of Public Health standards (New Haven School System and Bridgeport School System already decided no fall football)).

No 11 on 11 full contact football games, also no 7 on 7 football games (football coaches never really liked the CIAC suggested idea of 7 on 7 football). Conditioning and practice are still allowed. Passing leagues and combines are allowed. No decision on spring football games.

Girls volleyball (girls volleyball in fall, boys volleyball in spring, in Connecticut). Girls volleyball coaches didn't like the CIAC suggested idea of fall outdoor (weather issues) volleyball games, so all players will wear masks while playing indoor volleyball.

Football and girls volleyball were the two main points of contention between the CIAC and State Department of Public Health.

Boys and girls cross country. Staggered starts and finishes to maintain social distancing.

Girls swimming (girls swimming in fall, boys swimming in winter, in Connecticut). "Virtual" meets. Teams swim in their home pools and compare times after the "virtual" meet.

Boys soccer, girls soccer, girls field hockey. Only minor restrictions.

Game schedules will be based on short bus rides to adjacent schools, towns, and cities, ignoring traditional conference or league schedules, and school rivalries.

Fewer games scheduled in the season.

__________________
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Sep 07, 2020 at 10:34am.
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old Sun Sep 06, 2020, 12:11pm
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Tournament Experiences ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Latest news from Connecticut Interscholastic Athletic Conference (the state interscholastic sports governing body) regarding fall sports ... Fewer games scheduled in the season.
Maximum twelve regular season games (down from usual twenty).

CIAC states that there may be some post season "tournament experiences", falling short of calling it state championships. There has been some mention of regional "tournament experiences" in our geographically small state.

(If football had been played (it won't), maximum six regular season games.)
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"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16)

“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)
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