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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 02:23pm
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NCAA Permits Patches That Promote Social Justice Causes ...

The NCAA will permit college athletes to wear patches on their uniforms that promote and support social justice causes.

As approved by the NCAA’s Playing Rules Oversight Panel, athletes in all sports will be permitted to “express support and voice their opinions” in two places on their uniforms: one on the front or sleeve of the uniform or on the nameplate on the back of the uniform — the spot typically reserved for the athlete’s last name.

The patches can also be for “commemorative and memorial purposes,” not solely for social issues. Predictably, the messages will require approval by “the school or conference.”

The patch on the front of the uniform will not exceed 2 ¼ square inches and “must be identical for those who choose to wear them,” though not all team members will be required to do so. The patch on the back will be an individual choice with “names/words intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes” permitted.

Here’s how the NCAA explained it in a press release:

The patch on the front, which most sports already allowed, as authorized by the school or conference, may be a commemorative/memorial patch (names, mascots, nicknames, logos and marks) intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes. The patch must not exceed 2¼ square inches and must be placed on the front or sleeve of the uniform. While not all team members are required to wear the patch, they must be identical for those who choose to wear them.

The second location is on the back of the uniform where the player name is traditionally located and, as authorized by the school or conference, will allow names/words intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes. The names or words may vary by team member.


https://sports.yahoo.com/ncaa-will-p...174050438.html
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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 03:38pm
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Absolutely ridiculous.


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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 04:11pm
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No issues what so ever. The world is changing and so is this country. We put American Flags on things that is a political statement. Get rid of them all or do not complain when it is something that goes outside of your belief system. IJS.

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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 04:47pm
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NCAA Permits Patches That Promote Social Justice Causes ...

We don’t put flags on as a political statement. We put flags on because we live in the United States of America.

Adding social justice messages only serves to divide us.


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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 05:04pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhistlesAndStripes View Post
Adding social justice messages only serves to divide us.
... or they're an attempt to educate us and to unite us in causes supported by the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

I can foresee problems with messages being approved or disapproved by colleges and universities, especially with state colleges and universities where there is probably more of an expectation of First Amendment rights not fully expected in private college or university settings.

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“I was in prison and you came to visit me.” (Matthew 25:36)

Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Jul 31, 2020 at 10:35am.
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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 05:04pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhistlesAndStripes View Post
We don’t put flags on as a political statement. We put flags on because we live in the United States of America.

Adding social justice messages only serves to divide us.
They were never on our jerseys before 9-11. I got pushed into that rightfully or wrongfully. I went along with that display which has caused more issues than you might realize. That was a political statement. It was not necessary before. So yes it was political. This is political on some level or because of social justice in itself it political. Divide who again? At least in basketball, a vast majority of the players are of one race who might feel very different than you do and in football, most of the top players (At the D1 level) are certain people that have been affected by things in this society. If that bothers you, get over it, they are doing it anyway. It also says that it has to be approved by the institution, so there are a lot of steps before it ends up on the court. I say that because people like me do not care what now divides us when we have been divided for years and decades. The funeral of John Lewis made that clear today alone. I am not threatened by social issues that need to be addressed with the people that look like me. Good for the NCAA, but they have other issues to deal with from my point of view. This is at least a good step.

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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 05:19pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
... or they're an attempt to educate us and to unite us in causes supported by the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

I can foresee problems with messages being approved or disapproved by colleges and universities, especially with state colleges and universities where there is probably more of an expectation of First Amendment rights not fully expected in a private college or university settings.
I do not see this as an issue, I am sure this will be about what the players want to do. Now if they are made to do something, that word will get out and players that might be considering certain schools might decide those are not the places for them to go. Believe it or not, players are considering a lot of things when being recruited. You create a certain environment for the players, that could backfire. I do not think all schools will do this anyway. I do not think all teams will want to do this. But the option is there or you might have other situations where things end up on sneakers or other items.

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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 05:55pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
They were never on our jerseys before 9-11. I got pushed into that rightfully or wrongfully. I went along with that display which has caused more issues than you might realize. That was a political statement. It was not necessary before. So yes it was political. This is political on some level or because of social justice in itself it political. Divide who again? At least in basketball, a vast majority of the players are of one race who might feel very different than you do and in football, most of the top players (At the D1 level) are certain people that have been affected by things in this society. If that bothers you, get over it, they are doing it anyway. It also says that it has to be approved by the institution, so there are a lot of steps before it ends up on the court. I say that because people like me do not care what now divides us when we have been divided for years and decades. The funeral of John Lewis made that clear today alone. I am not threatened by social issues that need to be addressed with the people that look like me. Good for the NCAA, but they have other issues to deal with from my point of view. This is at least a good step.



Peace


I'm with you. I resisted the whole flag thing when it involved patches. I showed up and my partners would say "patch or no patch" and they'd give me the stink eye when I'd say "It's no patch tonight. I don't have flag patches." Eventually it was easier to just get flags than deal with crews that thought I wasn't patriotic enough cause I had to remind everyone what country I was in.


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Old Thu Jul 30, 2020, 07:18pm
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The Flag Code ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
They were never on our jerseys before 9-11. I got pushed into that rightfully or wrongfully. I went along with that display which has caused more issues than you might realize. That was a political statement. It was not necessary before. So yes it was political.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
I'm with you. I resisted the whole flag thing when it involved patches. I showed up and my partners would say "patch or no patch" and they'd give me the stink eye when I'd say "It's no patch tonight. I don't have flag patches." Eventually it was easier to just get flags than deal with crews that thought I wasn't patriotic enough cause I had to remind everyone what country I was in.
I believe that we started wearing flag patches during the 2003 invasion of Iraq. Although I did wear it, I also felt that it wasn't right because of the Flag Code:

No disrespect should be shown to the flag of the United States of America; No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations.

I believed that it was disrespectful to equate basketball officials to our military, firemen, and policemen heroes.

Since 2003 I have used an image of the American flag and the Statue of Liberty as my desktop image on my personal computer, my laptop computer and my cellphone, vowing not to remove these images until the last American soldier leaves Iraq.

I've been waiting seventeen years.

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Old Fri Jul 31, 2020, 07:52am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhistlesAndStripes View Post
We don’t put flags on as a political statement. We put flags on because we live in the United States of America.

Adding social justice messages only serves to divide us.


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I purposely didn't wear flag patches on my uniforms. I served 22 years in the military (started officiated in my 18th year of active duty 2 months after 9/11). It felt like an empty attempt to show "patriotism" to me. I lived life everyday serving my country, I didn't need a display of symbolism to show my patriotism.
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Old Fri Jul 31, 2020, 08:21am
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Why do the rulesmaking bodies even get into these minutiae? Are they afraid it'll lead to paid sponsorship of individual players? How does a worn patch affect the administration of games?
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Old Fri Jul 31, 2020, 09:16am
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The Monkey's Paw (W. W. Jacobs) ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman View Post
Why do the rulesmaking bodies even get into these minutiae?


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Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Jul 31, 2020 at 10:44am.
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Old Sun Aug 02, 2020, 01:53pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
I'm with you. I resisted the whole flag thing when it involved patches. I showed up and my partners would say "patch or no patch" and they'd give me the stink eye when I'd say "It's no patch tonight. I don't have flag patches." Eventually it was easier to just get flags than deal with crews that thought I wasn't patriotic enough cause I had to remind everyone what country I was in.


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Let's go to the next issue..Kneeling during the National Anthem. NBA referees knelt the other night. On the High School and College level, what if members of the crew are split on this..some kneeling and others not?
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Old Sun Aug 02, 2020, 01:54pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
The NCAA will permit college athletes to wear patches on their uniforms that promote and support social justice causes.

As approved by the NCAA’s Playing Rules Oversight Panel, athletes in all sports will be permitted to “express support and voice their opinions” in two places on their uniforms: one on the front or sleeve of the uniform or on the nameplate on the back of the uniform — the spot typically reserved for the athlete’s last name.

The patches can also be for “commemorative and memorial purposes,” not solely for social issues. Predictably, the messages will require approval by “the school or conference.”

The patch on the front of the uniform will not exceed 2 ¼ square inches and “must be identical for those who choose to wear them,” though not all team members will be required to do so. The patch on the back will be an individual choice with “names/words intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes” permitted.

Here’s how the NCAA explained it in a press release:

The patch on the front, which most sports already allowed, as authorized by the school or conference, may be a commemorative/memorial patch (names, mascots, nicknames, logos and marks) intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes. The patch must not exceed 2¼ square inches and must be placed on the front or sleeve of the uniform. While not all team members are required to wear the patch, they must be identical for those who choose to wear them.

The second location is on the back of the uniform where the player name is traditionally located and, as authorized by the school or conference, will allow names/words intended to celebrate or memorialize people, events or other causes. The names or words may vary by team member.


https://sports.yahoo.com/ncaa-will-p...174050438.html
Thoughts on how this will be handled at HS level? Will this come from NFHS or individual state associations?
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Old Sun Aug 02, 2020, 02:29pm
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Elephant In The Room ...

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Originally Posted by The_Rookie View Post
Let's go to the next issue..Kneeling during the National Anthem. NBA referees knelt the other night. On the High School and College level, what if members of the crew are split on this..some kneeling and others not?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
I really don't want to get into the politics of such an act, but I did have one team do it this season. Girls varsity. Small inner city charter (magnet) school. Entire team, and coach, are African American. The players lined up along the free throw line extended, standing, holding hands, facing the flag. When the music started, they all knelt down to one knee, still holding hands, still facing the flag. Coach was standing at his bench, hand over heart. At the end of the Anthem, they all stood up and headed toward their bench for a quick huddle before the jump ball to start the game.

As a church going person who often kneels to show reverence, I was not shocked by this quiet, but impactful, demonstration. And I like to think that my Dad, who fought his way across North Africa, Sicily, and Italy, in World War II, would not be shocked either.
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...ml#post1017657
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Last edited by BillyMac; Sun Aug 02, 2020 at 03:25pm.
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