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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 02:39pm
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What fouls count toward team foul count

I thought that all technical fouls counted toward the team foul count.
If a player gets a T then we are increasing the team foul count by one.
Same for a coach direct or indirect. I am looking in the book for when a T doesn't count toward the team foul count.

Help please.
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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 03:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I thought that all technical fouls counted toward the team foul count.
If a player gets a T then we are increasing the team foul count by one.
Same for a coach direct or indirect. I am looking in the book for when a T doesn't count toward the team foul count.

Help please.
For HS, all T's count as a team foul.

For indirects, remember it is really someone else's direct T that the coach gets charged with as an indirect....but there has only been one actual foul. A coach can't get an indirect without someone else getting a direct. That is why the indirect doesn't get counted in the team fouls since the actual direct T (on someone else) is already being counted.
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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 03:47pm
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All technical fouls do count toward the foul count in NF Rules.

Do not get confused with what is called a direct or indirect technical and trying to equate those as two separate acts. Those are classifications for what happens to bench personnel and the number that go toward the head coach for disqualification. A technical towards a bench personnel member is both a direct technical to the individual and an indirect to the head coach. You do not shoot 4 FTs, you only shoot 2 FTs for the single technical foul that was given. A head coach cannot get 3 indirect technicals (all given to bench personnel) and stay in the game.

Also, college basketball is a little different and I do not want to muddy the water by explaining that situation unless you really want that answer.

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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 03:52pm
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I just took the test and one of the questions was what technical does not count as a team foul.

And one choice wasn't any of the above... Does anyone see a question on this year's test about which kind of T doesn't count as a team foul?
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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 04:16pm
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Indirect Technical Foul ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I just took the test and one of the questions was what technical does not count as a team foul.
An indirect technical foul does not count as a team foul.

4-8-2: Player-control, team-control and technical fouls are counted as
team fouls to reach the bonus. When a technical foul is also charged
indirectly to the head coach, it counts only as one team foul.

4-19-13: A team foul is any personal foul or technical foul (except
indirect technical fouls) which is charged to either team. All team fouls are
counted to reach the bonus free throw.

Rule 10 Penalties Summary NOTE: All fouls (except an indirect technical foul charged to the head
coach) count toward the team's foul count in the half.
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Last edited by BillyMac; Mon Nov 11, 2019 at 04:31pm.
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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 04:52pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I thought that all technical fouls counted toward the team foul count.
If a player gets a T then we are increasing the team foul count by one.
Same for a coach direct or indirect. I am looking in the book for when a T doesn't count toward the team foul count.

Help please.

Question 91:
A team foul does not include:
a.
Technical foul on a player.
b.
Personal foul on a player.
c.
Direct technical foul on the head coach.
d.
Indirect technical foul on the head coach.

Explanation

4-19-13
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Old Mon Nov 11, 2019, 08:08pm
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D is the correct answer to the question Nevadaref posted.

In men's college, administrative and class B technical fouls do not count towards the bonus. In women's college, administrative technical fouls do not count towards the bonus. In NFHS and NCAAW rules, indirect technical fouls to the head coach cannot be assessed without a direct technical foul to someone else on the bench.
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Old Tue Nov 12, 2019, 02:29pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilyazhito View Post
D is the correct answer to the question Nevadaref posted.

In men's college, administrative and class B technical fouls do not count towards the bonus. In women's college, administrative technical fouls do not count towards the bonus. In NFHS and NCAAW rules, indirect technical fouls to the head coach cannot be assessed without a direct technical foul to someone else on the bench.
It is a Direct T on the player too that comes off the bench at the NF level. This is not about what college does at all and that will do nothing but confuse the issue.

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Old Tue Nov 12, 2019, 10:11pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
I thought that all technical fouls counted toward the team foul count.
If a player gets a T then we are increasing the team foul count by one.
Same for a coach direct or indirect. I am looking in the book for when a T doesn't count toward the team foul count.

Help please.
In high school rules, any technical foul charged to any individual counts towards the team foul total. If the offender is bench personnel, that technical foul is also charged indirectly to the head coach. Only the offender's technical foul counts for purposes of the team foul count.
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Old Wed Nov 13, 2019, 11:27am
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Omission ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by ilyazhito View Post
In high school rules, any technical foul charged to any individual counts towards the team foul total.
While true, that doesn't tell the whole story. How about technical fouls charged to a team?
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Old Wed Nov 13, 2019, 12:40pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
While true, that doesn't tell the whole story. How about technical fouls charged to a team?
You don't know the answer?
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Old Wed Nov 13, 2019, 04:28pm
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Rhetorical Question ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
You don't know the answer?
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Old Wed Nov 13, 2019, 06:38pm
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BigT was looking for situations when technical fouls do NOT count towards the team foul total in NFHS rules. The only occasion that happens for is indirect technical fouls to the head coach.
Of course, the offender is charged the technical foul, and it counts towards the team, but the team does not get put in double jeopardy with regards to the team foul count for bench personnel being an [email protected]
Team and administrative technical fouls also count towards the team foul count, unlike at other levels.
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Old Thu Nov 14, 2019, 11:10am
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Thank you all for helping me in my stupid moment. Have a great season and as always thanks for the help on the greatest referee forum ever!
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Old Fri Nov 29, 2019, 12:14am
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Originally Posted by BigT View Post
Thank you all for helping me in my stupid moment. Have a great season and as always thanks for the help on the greatest referee forum ever!


You are not alone; this is surprisingly confusing to so many officials. A couple of years ago I was spectating a varsity boys game right behind the table. Game started with FTs for an admin T. Table didn’t put the team foul on the board and the game continued. Thinking it was a table oversight and trying to help the crew, I whispered to the scorer during a dead ball and they put the team foul on the board.

A minute later some knucklehead in the crew saw it on the board and took it off, insisting the admin tech did not count as a team foul. Both of his partners agreed with him.

I couldn’t believe it. Varsity crew. Ended up costing the offended team a bonus free throw later on, too. Luckily it was not a close game.


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