Referees and Forfeits

[coach41]

In all my years of officiating, whenever there is a forfeit of a game on game day, the official does not work even if teams / players want to scrimmage and the official is available (say, they are working another game afterward).

I had an odd situation yesterday where I was not told a game was a forfeit until way later in the game (long story, not relevant to my point).

So question is, what is the official guidelines for referees on forfeits? I looked up the NFHS rule book but the forfeit rules didn't really answer my question.

SO just curious where (NFHS, League, Section) the guidelines state officials shouldn't work a scrimmage after a game has been declared a forfeit?

[BillyMac]

When in Rome ...

Not exactly a forfeit, but ...

I showed up for a freshman game (4:00 p.m. start) last season, and got the last minute cancellation call from the athletic director as I was walking in the gymnasium door. My game was was supposed to be the first game of a triple header (freshman, junior varsity, varsity) but due to a late change in the Christmas Tournament schedule only the junior varsity game and the varsity game got officially cancelled, the freshman cancellation was overlooked. My partner, who lived a lot closer to the school, got his call at home and never made the trip.

Athletic director assured me that I would be paid for the cancelled game. The odd thing was that both freshman teams were in the gym, in uniform, warming up, with a scorekeeper and timekeeper in attendance, as well as several parents in the bleachers.

Freshman coach, who I knew, approached me and asked if I could please officiate a few periods of a scrimmage. I was there, so I figured why not, and told him I would do a few periods as long as both teams took the scrimmage seriously (no fooling around, no knuckleheads). I felt no pressure to work the scrimmage.

I got changed, worked a few periods, and was having so much fun that I stayed for all four periods.

The next day, my assigner got an email from the athletic director complimenting me, and our board.

I got to try out my one person mechanics, saw some enthusiastic basketball from some young players, got a nice $63.05 check (I didn't ask for a 1 1/2 fee), got some good will at two schools and with the coaching staffs, and made some points with my assigner.

And I still made it home in time for dinner.

As usual, check your local listings.

[JRutledge]

A lot depends on the circumstances of the contract. If I am asked to work a game and there is a forfeit, there is nothing that obligates me to work anything outside of that contract. There is not a guideline, because the NF has nothing to do with scheduled games. They only say what you put in the scorebook at the end. The NF does not control what constitutes or should be a forfeit in a league or state.

I can tell you right now, I am not working a game that is not contracted if it took place that same day.

Peace

If I show up and it’s a forfeit I am collecting my check and leaving. They pay me for my availability and time, refereeing is something I do for free once I’m there.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by AremRed

If I show up and it’s a forfeit I am collecting my check and leaving.

I've only had a couple of true forfeits, all almost forty years ago when I was still working recreation basketball. In all cases the game was forfeited because of poor behavior by one of the teams in the game. Absolutely no way am I hanging around to work a scrimmage "for the kids" after such forfeits.

Forfeits for other reasons? Depends. Middle school game with the game ready to start, scorers, timers, fans in stands, but only four kids show up for one team? One team wants to give the other a few players and play a "scrimmage"? Maybe.

Impossible for me to give a general answer, I guess that I'd have to be there to give a good answer.

[coach41]

Since everyone shared their experiences, I might as well explain what happened yesterday.

The league itself a large Church league featuring about 70+ teams spread over multiple divisions (3 or 4 divisions for 18 year old and above / the rest are kids from high school to 3rd / 4th grade, 5th / 6th, 7th /8th divisions). I played in the league for 25 years bu stopped around 2014. I stayed connected with the league by officiating.

The officiating situation is different too. Because of complaints over the years, the league went with the concept of "head officials". Basically they pay for one experienced official to manage the other officials who are players in the league. All teams in the league have to score keep and officiate throughout the summer. So as you can imagine, the quality of officiating is pretty bad at times.

So in my case yesterday, I had 3 games with one of the kids leagues (7th / 8th grade would be my guess, though I wasn't sure).

All the games were yawners. But it was the second game that had a weird vibe from the get go. Team #1 was complaining about calls. I guess it got to the point that one of the other officials gave a technical to the team that was complaining.

Team #2 had a guy who scored a basket and grabbed the ball and seemed like to me he was trash talking a bit.

At halftime, I just told both coaches to have their kids play ball as the weird vibe was there. The game went back and forth and was close until the end.

But this is where the weirdness finally showed. Team #1 had played with 5 players the whole game and out of the blue, a sixth player was in the game (this was super late, under 2 minutes left). I asked the other official about it to confirm if the kid was late as I remembered Team #1 had only 5 players in the book.

The other official said "yes, but I let it go since the game is a forfeit". I said "oh really, since when was this game a forfeit?" Apparently, team #2 had called in a forfeit and brought some other kids to just have a game. BUT I wasn't told.

At this point, I kind of just said "Ok, fine" and just let things go. But I told the other official to tell the coach of Team #1 (because the official was also the main guy who coordinated his church's teams including Team #1) that he can't just stick a guy in the game like that without penalty.

I also told this particular official (he does kids games, but he's not in a high school group or anything) that if you're going to have us officiate a game like this (and give a technical to his own team) then not having a player in the book was worthy of a technical as well. But it was super late and it would have created more drama that it was worth.

So now you understand why I asked. If I had known it was a forfeit, I would have just sat down and taken a break before working the 3rd and final game.

[Nevadaref]

Contests which are forfeited can put referees in an awkward situation. You need to know the basics before you step onto the floor for any "scrimmage" which may take place after a forfeit has been declared.

1. Insurance coverage -- what is the coverage for yourself and the participants? Know or find out if your state, league, etc. provides coverage. If not, I wouldn't officiate.

2. Compensation -- know what you are receiving for a forfeit and/or the action which replaces it, if anything. Inquire beforehand, if you must. Don't just expect financial compensation, there may not be any. Make certain that you will receive what you desire. If you are happy officiating for free, that is your choice, but I advise getting the information upfront.

3. Consequences -- what are the ramifications to YOU? Understand what the person who made the assignment expects you to do. Are you to stay and officiate unofficial action or are you to depart? There could well be a difference if the contest is from an outside assignor or handled internally by the school admin. What is expected of you could have an impact on future assignments from that person. If you don't know, ask! Pick up the phone and make a call before proceeding, if you must. Don't cost yourself several future games by mishandling one forfeited contest.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by coach41

... not having a player in the book was worthy of a technical as well.

Be careful here. The technical foul is not for not having a player listed in the scorebook.

If a team adds a name to the team roster after the ten minute time limit, then a team technical foul is charged. When such a player legally enters the court, the player’s name and uniform number must be entered into the official scorebook. In order to penalize this infraction, the offending team member must be one of the five players currently in the game.

This infraction occurs when the scorer is advised to add to the official scorebook. The foul must be charged when it occurs and enforced when the ball next becomes live. Once the ball becomes live, after such changes have been made to the scorebook, it is too late to penalize.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Contests which are forfeited can put referees in an awkward situation. You need to know the basics before you step onto the floor for any "scrimmage" which may take place after a forfeit has been declared ... Insurance coverage ...

Agree. Forfeit is declared. Officials, coaches, and administrators agree to have a "scrimmage". Player accidentally gets seriously hurt in the scrimmage. Parents sue for negligence saying that the officials should have ended the game with the forfeit and that the scrimmage should never have been played, and thus, the serious injury should have never happened.

The plaintiff may not prevail, but the officials will still have to hire an attorney and defend themselves in a court of law. Lots of billable hours involved.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by coach41

...

SO just curious where (NFHS, League, Section) the guidelines state officials shouldn't work a scrimmage after a game has been declared a forfeit?

My liability insurance guides me.

[RefBob]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Agree. Forfeit is declared. Officials, coaches, and administrators agree to have a "scrimmage". Player accidentally gets seriously hurt in the scrimmage. Parents sue for negligence saying that the officials should have ended the game with the forfeit and that the scrimmage should never have been played, and thus, the serious injury should have never happened.

The plaintiff may not prevail, but the officials will still have to hire an attorney and defend themselves in a court of law. Lots of billable hours involved.

Because of the above, our Association has clearly told us not to officiate these informal scrimmages as they are not official games under the auspices of the state school activities association. Therefore, not clear that we have any type of liability coverage.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RefBob

Because of the above, our Association has clearly told us not to officiate these informal scrimmages as they are not official games under the auspices of the state school activities association. Therefore, not clear that we have any type of liability coverage.

I am pretty sure that my state has coverage for all games in and out of high school in the sports we are registered to work. So if something were to happen, you are covered for games that are not normal games. Now that might change based on the type of insurance you have. And there could be some basic coverage that you would just as if you are doing the same sport. I would check this out, but my understanding of my state insurance plan, which is not with the NF covers all levels of the sport.

Peace