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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 11:14am
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Wrong? number on a double foul

Had this happen to me Fri night. GV , hotly contested game. I have a two girls banging and pushing each other in front of me as the trail. I blow and call a double foul. I turn to look at the two jerseys to get the numbers. I report to the table "double foul , black 22 and white 11. We go to the point of interuption when the white coach calls us over because the table wasnt sure of the numbers. i repeat and the table and black coach are telling me that the foul was not black 22, but black 12. Both these players were in the game. I was pretty sure I had 22 as for the foul. My partner and I discuss but I felt like I didnt want to change my call ... Question: Would any of you change the call based on what the entire table seemed to have had. Just had me doubting myself. My partner didnt see the foul as it was way out of his primary.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 11:20am
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It depends on how confident you are in what you had, and how you read the "confidence" and "impartiality" of those who are giving you the different number.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 11:43am
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Actually I misstyped that the Black coach was questioning, which would have made more sense. It was the White coach who was questioning the black foul not even her player. The table was made up of younger students, clock keeper, home and away books. Actually the away book started the question initially. But all at the table agreed. I guess if I missed saw the number (always a possiblity ... the big secret in officiating, we actually make mistakes sometimes) I could have went along, but I also figured that now I have to deal with the black coach by making the change.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 11:52am
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Mixed Up ...

Double fouls, while a very useful tool, are few and far between for me, only one so far this year, after two knuckleheads didn't heed my, "Stop it", warning.

When I do call them, I invariably have to concentrate on the numbers, more so than a regular foul report. I'm always afraid that I will report "White 24, Blue 42", instead of, "White 42, Blue 24", or somehow screw it up even worse.

Also, I hate it when jerseys are so loose that they fold over making it difficult to see a number, 12 or 22, seems to happen more on the girls side than on the boys side.
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Last edited by BillyMac; Sun Feb 03, 2019 at 01:00pm.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 12:37pm
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If everyone at the table ever told me that I had the number wrong I don't even discuss it and I change the name. This happens once every few years and they are most likely correct.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 01:04pm
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I have changed the number of the fouler before based on the table, based on partners, based on players, and based on coaches.

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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 02:19pm
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Depends on situation...whoís at table. Ideally, youíve got to know who youíre calling fouls on...(also ideally...get the first one so youíre not calling doubles) Hopefully your partners can help if your in a bind...lastly the table but I d have to know and trust them...There are tables I know will tell me truth regardless...and Iím willling to go down with them. There are other tables I canít ever count on..Otherwise, you made the call and youíll have to live with it.

You are right there.. and if your sure then stay with it. If your considering these other options sounds like your not sure. See above but if no one is sure or trustworthy itís on you..
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 03:54pm
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Turn around and see who's guarding white 11?
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 04:32pm
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Verbalizing at the spot of the double foul can be a huge help. And good for you for ruling it a double.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 04:46pm
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Poorly Wired ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by billyu2 View Post
Verbalizing at the spot of the double foul can be a huge help. And good for you for ruling it a double.
I do that and I'm still think I'm going to confuse the double foul numbers by the time I get to the reporting area. That's the way my brain is wired, poorly.

I gave up trying to remember the shooter's number a long time ago. I'll point the shooter out to my partner, even state, "Shooter" while pointing, may even take a look at the shooter's appearance, but no way in hell will I look at the shooter's number because I guarantee that I'll confuse the fouler's number and the shooter's number by the time I get to the reporting area. Again, that's the way my brain is wired, poorly.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 05:15pm
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Double Fouls and Dead Ball Efficiency.

Dead Ball Efficiency. Fred Horgan of Canada has, for years, been giving a speech about Dead Ball Efficiency. I am sure that our brother and sister from the Great White Way and my fellow IAABO Members (in the U.S., Canada, and elsewhere) have now doubt heard it either in person or by video tape.

What is Dead Ball Efficiency and how does it relate to Double Fouls? Great question. The first thing to remember is that nothing good, for the most part, and happen when the Ball is Dead, so naturally, we want to minimize the amount of time the Ball is Dead. But, the second thing to remember is that taking time to get everything correct is not the same as dawdling and thereby unnecessarily extending the Dead Ball time period.

And the third thing to remember is that when one has to stop the game for an unusual situation, i.e., DFs, FDFs, MFs, FMFs, and TFs, is to not rush. Those few extra seconds to stop and check the numbers of the miscreants involved and then taking a few extra seconds to explain the Fouls when reporting them will actually shorten the time that the Ball will be Dead. It lessen the chance of being recalled to the Table to explain what happened and what will happen.

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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 05:16pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
I do that and I'm still think I'm going to confuse the double foul numbers by the time I get to the reporting area. That's the way my brain is wired, poorly.

I gave up trying to remember the shooter's number a long time ago. I'll point the shooter out to my partner, even state, "Shooter" while pointing, may even take a look at the shooter's appearance, but no way in hell will I look at the shooter's number because I guarantee that I'll confuse the fouler's number and the shooter's number by the time I get to the reporting area. Again, that's the way my brain is wired, poorly.
Well, in a few cases same here. But that is because of our age factor. The hope is, by "communicating" the numbers aloud, someone else (with good wiring) might be able to bail us out when needed.
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Old Sun Feb 03, 2019, 10:44pm
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If there is doubt, get all the input you can to get it correct, including, just asking the girls. I am yet, in officiating multiple sports, to ever have a female athlete not answer me truthfully, when I asked.
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Old Mon Feb 04, 2019, 01:40pm
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I once had a partner call a double foul on two guys going at it pretty intensely in the post. He made them move over to center court near the scorer's table to shake hands while he reported the foul. I thought maybe something had escalated quickly between the two, so I asked him about it at half so I would know what to look for going forward. He laughed and told me he was just afraid of mixing up their numbers. I gave him a hard time because I had spent the last few minutes of the 2nd quarter focusing on them in the post when I was L assuming there might be some bad blood.
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Old Mon Feb 04, 2019, 01:56pm
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Bravo ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomerSooner View Post
He laughed and told me he was just afraid of mixing up their numbers.
Give that man a cigar.
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