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-   -   Boy dunks during halftime of girls game.... (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/104193-boy-dunks-during-halftime-girls-game.html)

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:54pm

Wear Out My Welcome ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 102704)
... yesterday ...

That brings to mind one of my favorite Beatles songs. Wait. I'm being told ... Too much? Too soon? Never mind.

SC Official Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by LRZ (Post 1027049)
If I'm in the stands, watching an earlier game, or on my way to the locker room, my jurisdiction has not yet begun.

Exactly. And I would, in my case, add "or officiating the first game of a DH" since games are assigned as pairs here.

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 01:01pm

Checking It Twice ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by LRZ (Post 1027049)
If I'm in the stands, watching an earlier game, or on my way to the locker room, my jurisdiction has not yet begun.

I enjoy watching my friends working state tournament games. I usually arrive early to get a seat away from crowd, and don't go into the locker room thus interrupting their pregame. When they come out onto the floor I always greet them and tell them that I've got a list of the pregame dunkers. I get a lot of funny replies and a few fingers, and it's usually not the finger that tells me we have less than one minute left in the period.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Tue Dec 11, 2018 02:15pm

On a more humorous note or: "And now for something completely different."
 
One of not so numerous problems of officiating in either AAU or YBOA Girls' Nationals was younger brothers wanting to shoot around at half time. I would ask the boys if they shaved their legs every day. The answer was always a resounding NO! I would tell them that the only people that could shoot around were those that shaved their legs every day. That kept them off the court.

MTD, Sr.

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 02:20pm

I Know, I Was Once One Of Them ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 1027063)
.. wanting to shoot around at half time.

Here in Connecticut we call these "gym rats". They come out of the woodwork any time the court is free.

#olderthanilook Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1027040)
The rule does not say anytime during the pregame whether that be an hour or 20 minutes before the game. This all applies when the officials have jurisdiction over their game. Halftime of another game has nothing to do with the game the players are playing in. I guess you would also require the players to remove jewelry, illegal equipment or tell them to take off certain color sleeves or items that do not fit the color restrictions during the halftime of the previous games as well? And when they do not comply, are you going to not allow them to play or give them a technical foul if they do not follow your instructions?

Peace

The state I work in has adopted it's own rule. From an official online message to all basketball officials:

"Players may not dunk during the pregame warm-up before their game or during the half-time of the preceding game. Administration and coaches are responsible to make sure players do not dunk during these periods. Once officials arrive on the court if dunking occurs the penalty is a technical foul. The foul is also charged indirectly to the head coach and the coach loses his/her coaching box privilege for the remainder of the game. This rule is outlined in the basketball manual and is to be followed by all schools during the regular and post season."

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:12pm

When The Grand Poobah Talks, People Listen ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 1027071)
"Players may not dunk during the pregame warm-up before their game or during the half-time of the preceding game. Administration and coaches are responsible to make sure players do not dunk during these periods. Once officials arrive on the court if dunking occurs the penalty is a technical foul. The foul is also charged indirectly to the head coach and the coach loses his/her coaching box privilege for the remainder of the game. This rule is outlined in the basketball manual and is to be followed by all schools during the regular and post season."

The Grand Poobah has spoken.

#olderthanilook Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1027075)
The Grand Poobah has spoken.

The Wizard of Oz, as it were.

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:27pm

Listen (Chicago Transit Authority, 1969) ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 1027076)
The Wizard of Oz, as it were.

Or E.F. Hutton.

https://youtu.be/2_ygqPepLjM

Camron Rust Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 1027071)
The state I work in has adopted it's own rule. From an official online message to all basketball officials:

"Players may not dunk during the pregame warm-up before their game or during the half-time of the preceding game. Administration and coaches are responsible to make sure players do not dunk during these periods. Once officials arrive on the court if dunking occurs the penalty is a technical foul. The foul is also charged indirectly to the head coach and the coach loses his/her coaching box privilege for the remainder of the game. This rule is outlined in the basketball manual and is to be followed by all schools during the regular and post season."

Still (based on the text above), the officials for the game are not yet on the court for that game. Before that, it is on the administrators to deal with it.

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 03:46pm

Not My Game ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 1027080)
Still, the officials for the game are not yet on the court for that game. Before that, it is on the administrators to deal with it.

Yes, but once they're on the court they may still be responsible to enforce illegal dunking for personnel who aren't actually in "their" game, especially for officials in a game previous to a boys varsity game.

Is the technical foul charged in the illegal dunking game or in the following game?

If in the illegal dunking game, is there a penalty for adding a name to the scorebook?

Is the indirect technical foul charged in the illegal dunking game or in the following game?

Who sits, the illegal dunking coach, or the following game coach?

Are the technical foul free throws taken in the illegal dunking game, or in the following game?

Many questions, few answers.

I'm glad that I can just ignore.

#olderthanilook Tue Dec 11, 2018 04:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 1027080)
Still (based on the text above), the officials for the game are not yet on the court for that game. Before that, it is on the administrators to deal with it.

We are told by the state, in no uncertain terms mind you, that we officials are to take note and penalize any pre-game dunking during the half time of the preceding game if we see it happen. We are not to ignore.

Does this situation happen? Yes. I've personally witnessed it occur during an off night for me while watching a crew work my hometown team two seasons ago (no I wasn't off duty "whistle blowing" on the player that dunked - just an observer). BV dunked during the half time of the preceding JV game. V officials happened to see it.

The state reminds us of this prior to every season during our rules meeting or during an area meeting.

BillyMac Tue Dec 11, 2018 04:20pm

Details, Details ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 1027089)
We are told by the state, in no uncertain terms mind you, that we officials are to take note and penalize any pre-game dunking during the half time of the preceding game if we see it happen. We are not to ignore ... BV dunked during the half time of the preceding JV game. V officials happened to see it.

When in Rome ..., so please answer me these:

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1027085)
Is the technical foul charged in the illegal dunking game or in the following game?

If in the illegal dunking game, is there a penalty for adding a name to the scorebook?

Is the indirect technical foul charged in the illegal dunking game or in the following game?

Who sits, the illegal dunking coach, or the following game coach?

Are the technical foul free throws taken in the illegal dunking game, or in the following game?


JRutledge Tue Dec 11, 2018 04:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook (Post 1027071)
The state I work in has adopted it's own rule. From an official online message to all basketball officials:

"Players may not dunk during the pregame warm-up before their game or during the half-time of the preceding game. Administration and coaches are responsible to make sure players do not dunk during these periods. Once officials arrive on the court if dunking occurs the penalty is a technical foul. The foul is also charged indirectly to the head coach and the coach loses his/her coaching box privilege for the remainder of the game. This rule is outlined in the basketball manual and is to be followed by all schools during the regular and post season."

Then you needed to state that in your post where you basically accused those of not applying the rules. This is what your state does, not what everyone else does necessarily. That is a big piece of the puzzle or conversation you left out. But for the record, your reference in the casebook does not apply to this. I have never been told to penalize a player for pre-game activities of any kind during a game I had no jurisdiction over or that was not during the game or pre-game in question.

Peace

#olderthanilook Tue Dec 11, 2018 04:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1027096)
Then you needed to state that in your post where you basically accused those of not applying the rules. This is what your state does, not what everyone else does necessarily. That is a big piece of the puzzle or conversation you left out. But for the record, your reference in the casebook does not apply to this. I have never been told to penalize a player for pre-game activities of any kind during a game I had no jurisdiction over or that was not during the game or pre-game in question.

Peace

I didn't accuse. I asked if they/he/whoever supported it.

The answer was "no" along with some commentary.

Good enough for me.


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