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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Tue Oct 02, 2018, 03:50pm
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NFHS messes up GT and BI

Thought that I would post another messed up NFHS exam question.

"If a goaltending violation is penalized for touching the ball entering the basket from below:"

Yet the NFHS definition of goaltending is: "Goaltending occurs when a player touches the ball during a field-goal try or tap while the ball is in its downward flight entirely above the basket ring level, has the possibility of entering the basket in flight and is not touching the basket cylinder or a player touches the ball outside the cylinder during a free-throw attempt."

So the scenario proposed by the NFHS in the exam question does not qualify as goaltending!

The question should involve basket interference.
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 09:14am
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such an easy fix...

it would be so easy to run these questions past a knowledgeable group for judgement about accuracy and clarity.

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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 11:23am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by referee99 View Post
it would be so easy to run these questions past a knowledgeable group for judgement about accuracy and clarity.

SMH

Either IAABO's Rules Examination Committee or its Officials Education and Development Committee would be two such groups; I am sure that the California Basketball Officials Association has standing committees that could handle such an assignment; and the Ohio Association of Basketball Officials is another such organization that could handle such an assignment as well.

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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 11:48am
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What was the question even supposed to be about? I'm lucky that my answer on the DC rules test was correct, but I had no idea what the point was supposed to be.

I don't believe that there could be either BI or GT on this play, because GT requires a ball on its downward flight toward the basket, with a chance to score, and BI requires a ball on or inside the basket to be contacted, and the play in the question had neither. A ball entering the basket from below is a separate violation, so the ball would be dead before either BI or GT could apply.

Last edited by ilyazhito; Wed Oct 03, 2018 at 03:09pm.
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 11:51am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilyazhito View Post
What was the question even supposed to be about? I'mean lucky that my answer on the DC rules test was correct, but I had no idea what the point was supposed to be.

I don'the believe that there could be either BI or GT on this play, because GT requires a ball on its downward flight toward the basket, with a chance to score, and BI requires a ball on or inside the basket to be contacted, and the play in the question had neither.


Do you belong to the IAABO's DC Board?

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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 01:10pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilyazhito View Post
BI requires a ball on or inside the basket to be contacted, and the play in the question had neither.
Wasn't the ball in the basket in the OP?
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 02:00pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
Wasn't the ball in the basket in the OP?
Not necessarily....it doesn't say.

Quote:
If a goaltending violation is penalized for touching the ball entering the basket from below:
I thought this was poorly worded even ignoring the question of BI or GT. Exactly what is entering from below? The ball or the player's hand? I'm sure they mean the player's hand given the context but that sentence is horrible.

Even so, the ball may or may not be in the basket at the time it is touched. It is possible for a player to reach through the basket from below and touch/block a shot that has not yet entered the cylinder/basket. Either what, that is BI, not GT.

BI Rule:
Quote:
ART. 1 . . . Touches the ball or any part of the basket (including the net) while the ball is on or within either basket.
ART. 2 . . . Touches the ball while any part of the ball is within the imaginary cylinder which has the basket ring as its lower base.
ART. 3 . . . Touches the ball outside the cylinder while reaching through the basket from below.
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Last edited by Camron Rust; Wed Oct 03, 2018 at 02:03pm.
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 02:45pm
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Hagar The Horrible ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
Not necessarily ... it doesn't say ... this was poorly worded ... what is entering from below ... that sentence is horrible.
Horrible to say the least. When something is written to be printed and distrusted to a large number of recipients, doesn't somebody else edit, or at least read, such a document?
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 03:07pm
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I do. However, the DC Board (Board 12) no longer works public high school games in DC (other organizations have the contracts for public and charter school games), so Board 12 members don't usually take the DC test. I do, because I also belong to the organization that does have the DC public schools contract, and because I want the practice taking an earlier rules test (DC releases its tests earlier than MD and VA), so that I can do better on the MD and VA tests.
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Old Wed Oct 03, 2018, 04:31pm
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The question is intended to test your knowledge of the correct enforcement of 9-12 Penalty 3, but fails because it states goaltending instead of basket interference.

9-12 Penalty 3:
"If the violation results from touching the ball while it is in the basket after entering from below, no points are scored and the ball is awarded to the opponents for a throw-in from the designated out-of-bounds spot nearest the violation."

The question is poorly written, but attempts to describe the ball entering the net from below, yet not clearing the ring, and while inside of the net a player touches it.
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