had to do it!

[Bob Bball]

My partner had given him a T in the first half for excessive demonstrations using violation signals and yelling out for violations. He was talked to about this and still took a T.
He yelled constantly at his players and was visibly upset when they did not execute the offence correctly. he had given the scores table trouble about team fouls not going up fast enough and was talked to about that.
I have officiated for many years at high levels and now in my late sixties and do some games to have fun and stay in shape.

Yes, I was wrong in, baiting him, a bit - and feel just a little bad for doing it, However, I will recover! I am not sure if the kids that play for this coach will.

Having to play under his regime would be a daunting task. I know both my partner(a 22 year veteran) and I had enough of him in one game!

Yes, I would give one of officials I supervise a knuckle rapping for doing this: but, I had to do it!!!

[RedAndWhiteRef]

I'm still short of qualifying this as baiting. I'm interpreting "you, coach the team" as kind of like saying "you do you coach" and assuming he knew the rule.

Since when is it the official's responsibility to remind a coach of the rules?

Seriously, what am I missing here?

[deecee]

Originally Posted by RedAndWhiteRef

I'm still short of qualifying this as baiting. I'm interpreting "you, coach the team" as kind of like saying "you do you coach" and assuming he knew the rule.

Since when is it the official's responsibility to remind a coach of the rules?

Seriously, what am I missing here?

I'm guessing this is a VERY low level game. I would remind in these kinds of games.

[Adam]

At worst, "You do what you need to, I'm just here to enforce the rules."

Most likely, "Coach, there's a rule here that I have to enforce."

What I'd want to say "You're up by 73 points right now, I'm not making an exception. Teach your second string the press on your own time."

[RefsNCoaches]

Perhaps because my background coaching my daughters in travel and AAU when they were younger and my work with running youth leagues....I've got almost no tolerance for these types of coaches...If that rule isn't in place, all of a sudden what might be incidental contact while your pressing is probably going to become a foul somewhere in the 20 point lead range. Especially if I mention it to you and you still press. Either back em out or I'll find contact to whistle...and that's for the middle school and below I'm talking about...

[Pantherdreams]

If Coach comes to you and lets you know he is going to do something against the rules, I feel like good game management says you inform him of the rules violation and let him make his own decision.

Coach: "I'm going to get my bench player to work on: _____"

Now instead of the the press he says, jumping of each others backs to dunk, running with the ball, cursing at officials, etc. If you know a rules violation is coming and you can head it off, you head it off.


In regards to the pressing rule. I appreciate that in these sorts of situations particulary at the youth level every one is trying to so what is in the best interest of the kids and keep emotions from running high. I don't think there is a good answer. If you've got a shot clock and everyone is going to get reps and work on better things, having a rule that makes them back off is fine. If teams are now going to stop being pressed but to keep the score close not shoot, OR conversely the best chance they have to score is when the press breaks down because 5 v 5 they aren't going to get shots up then I'm not sure what it does.

[OKREF]

Up by 73, I'm not going to pass on anything if they are pressing. Just about any touch will get a whistle.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by RedAndWhiteRef

I'm still short of qualifying this as baiting. I'm interpreting "you, coach the team" as kind of like saying "you do you coach" and assuming he knew the rule.

Since when is it the official's responsibility to remind a coach of the rules?

Seriously, what am I missing here?

Say what? We remind coaches, players, table, spectators, etc.. all the time of the rules. (when team's reach 7 fould don't we remind them of the bonus free throw? when a coach is out of time outs, don't we remind them of that? During a timeout, don't we remind the teams at the first horn? When bench personnel are standing during regular live play, don't we remind them to sit? etc.)

When the coach said that he was going to practice the press, the official definitely should have offered a simple reminder of the league mercy rule. Preventative officiating all day long.

[RedAndWhiteRef]

Originally Posted by bucky

Say what? We remind coaches, players, table, spectators, etc.. all the time of the rules. (when team's reach 7 fould don't we remind them of the bonus free throw? when a coach is out of time outs, don't we remind them of that? During a timeout, don't we remind the teams at the first horn? When bench personnel are standing during regular live play, don't we remind them to sit? etc.)

When the coach said that he was going to practice the press, the official definitely should have offered a simple reminder of the league mercy rule. Preventative officiating all day long.

We'll agree to disagree. We're not babysitters. When it gets to seven fouls I don't say anything to the coaches. I say "line it up ladies/gentlemen, one-and-one."

This is a situation where the coach should be expected to know the rule. And a coach that actually has a problem with being T'd up while leading by over 70 points has issues beyond my control.

[BlueDevilRef]

Originally Posted by bucky

Say what? We remind coaches, players, table, spectators, etc.. all the time of the rules. (when team's reach 7 fould don't we remind them of the bonus free throw? when a coach is out of time outs, don't we remind them of that? During a timeout, don't we remind the teams at the first horn? When bench personnel are standing during regular live play, don't we remind them to sit? etc.)



When the coach said that he was going to practice the press, the official definitely should have offered a simple reminder of the league mercy rule. Preventative officiating all day long.

None of the things you mentioned are friendly reminders. They are rules that we play by. Once 7 team fouls, we shoot bonus. Notify of no time outs remaining, that is only time we are required to say anything. First horn is a rule required notification and rules dictate how we proceed in doing that. And players standing should be one warning and a bench T the next time, not a reminder.

And with all the info we have now about the coach being a jerk and already having had one T, I would have let him have his rope as well. Gotta get along before you go along.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Bob Bball

My partner had given him a T in the first half for excessive demonstrations using violation signals and yelling out for violations. He was talked to about this and still took a T.
He yelled constantly at his players and was visibly upset when they did not execute the offence correctly. he had given the scores table trouble about team fouls not going up fast enough and was talked to about that.
I have officiated for many years at high levels and now in my late sixties and do some games to have fun and stay in shape.

Yes, I was wrong in, baiting him, a bit - and feel just a little bad for doing it, However, I will recover! I am not sure if the kids that play for this coach will.

Having to play under his regime would be a daunting task. I know both my partner(a 22 year veteran) and I had enough of him in one game!

Yes, I would give one of officials I supervise a knuckle rapping for doing this: but, I had to do it!!!

I completely can relate. However we aren't the moral police, the parent's can take it up with him. I honestly don't understand how some parent's allow some coaches to behave the way they do. Some of the coaches I see when I work, if my kid were playing, I would get kicked out because I would cuss the out and treat him like the punk he is. Then I would tell my kid to get in the car, go home and the next day I would demand the administration gets a coach that can be a role model.

But hey, in sports people think its OK to act like an animal.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Bob Bball

My partner had given him a T in the first half for excessive demonstrations using violation signals and yelling out for violations. He was talked to about this and still took a T.
He yelled constantly at his players and was visibly upset when they did not execute the offence correctly. he had given the scores table trouble about team fouls not going up fast enough and was talked to about that.
I have officiated for many years at high levels and now in my late sixties and do some games to have fun and stay in shape.

Yes, I was wrong in, baiting him, a bit - and feel just a little bad for doing it, However, I will recover! I am not sure if the kids that play for this coach will.

Having to play under his regime would be a daunting task. I know both my partner(a 22 year veteran) and I had enough of him in one game!

Yes, I would give one of officials I supervise a knuckle rapping for doing this: but, I had to do it!!!

Nice information to have when first telling this story.

[bossman72]

We always use preventative officiating whenever possible. You were handed a scenario on a platter to use preventative officiating and you chose to take the low road simply to show the coach that you know the rule and he didn't and rub it in his face.

These "gotcha!" calls only tick people off and undermine your credibility as an official.

Not the path I would have chosen, IMO.

[bossman72]

Originally Posted by Bob Bball

My partner had given him a T in the first half for excessive demonstrations using violation signals and yelling out for violations. He was talked to about this and still took a T.
He yelled constantly at his players and was visibly upset when they did not execute the offence correctly. he had given the scores table trouble about team fouls not going up fast enough and was talked to about that.
I have officiated for many years at high levels and now in my late sixties and do some games to have fun and stay in shape.

Yes, I was wrong in, baiting him, a bit - and feel just a little bad for doing it, However, I will recover! I am not sure if the kids that play for this coach will.

Having to play under his regime would be a daunting task. I know both my partner(a 22 year veteran) and I had enough of him in one game!

Yes, I would give one of officials I supervise a knuckle rapping for doing this: but, I had to do it!!!

Ok maybe he deserved it then