Ejected From Tournament (Video)

[Welpe]

This type of foul can't be considered in a vacuum. Context, game temperature and the result all should factor into what needs to be called here.

I've called a nearly identical play a flagrant foul also. The game situation was the same as this one and the player had been a problem already that game. That made flagrant the right call.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BigCat

We're not asked to diagnose anything. Pretty simple here--if a kid has an event and /or he looks the least bit "off" send him out. School must then have him evaluated by certified trainer. If in doubt send them out. Easy.

Referees aren't getting sued every day and when we are we aren't losing. Law actually favors officials in liability area.

Let me rephrase my Iowa friend: Until someone misses a concussion and is held responsible because he was, after all, trained to recognize (not treat, but recognize) a concussion and have a player removed from play.

Or, we go ahead and send a player to the bench and get sued for affecting the game because it was the best player and a neurosurgeon showed up and said there was never a concussion.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

If she didn't fall into the wall - is it still worthy of disqualification?

I think it is. A blatant 2 handed shove in the back will only lead to something worse later. That's not a basketball move or play. That's dirty. Get her out of the game.

[frezer11]

Originally Posted by Adam

Or, we go ahead and send a player to the bench and get sued for affecting the game because it was the best player and a neurosurgeon showed up and said there was never a concussion.

Is this a serious comment? Is suing for this reason a real thing? I've never heard of a lawsuit for affecting a game, much less for the reason being discussed. Have you actually seen/heard of it before?

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by frezer11

Is this a serious comment? Is suing for this reason a real thing? I've never heard of a lawsuit for affecting a game, much less for the reason being discussed. Have you actually seen/heard of it before?

Case in Cobb county years ago. Georgia game to go to playoffs. 4th down and 20 or something. Defense is called for roughing punter. (Should been automatic first down/I don't do football.) Officials gave yardage but no first down. End of game when it happened. Other team gets ball and kicks field goal to win. If zebras don't screw up rule other team runs out clock and wins. Johhnys mom sues. Case tossed out of Court.

Jeff will know more about it but there was a rule screw up or something that if not made a different team would have played for State title here this past season. Court threw it out.

Court will not get involved in correcting this stuff.
Referees don't lose cases. Referees aren't being sued.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Adam

Let me rephrase my Iowa friend: Until someone misses a concussion and is held responsible because he was, after all, trained to recognize (not treat, but recognize) a concussion and have a player removed from play.

Or, we go ahead and send a player to the bench and get sued for affecting the game because it was the best player and a neurosurgeon showed up and said there was never a concussion.

The referee is low on totem pole. There are administrators, multiple coaches and parents in line for responsibility before us. They see Johhny bump his head also. They know Johnny. They all have more responsibility under law to Johnny than we do. It's not close. The programs are there to help us realize head injuries are serious and what to look for. For referees to lose a case like this it would need to be proven that we almost wanted Johhny to get hurt. Willful wanton. Not going to happen.

[rockyroad]

A. Question: the OP says that White 15 was ejected from the game and from the tournament? Why from the tournament? Unless we are talking about her missing the next game as part of the consequence of being ejected from this game? I am assuming that is what is meant in the OP, but want to clarify in my own mind...as someone else already stated, we can disqualify the player from the game, but certainly have no authority to disqualify a player from the tournament.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

A. Question: the OP says that White 15 was ejected from the game and from the tournament? Why from the tournament? Unless we are talking about her missing the next game as part of the consequence of being ejected from this game? I am assuming that is what is meant in the OP, but want to clarify in my own mind...as someone else already stated, we can disqualify the player from the game, but certainly have no authority to disqualify a player from the tournament.

U can toss her from the game and that's it. Up to school, league, and/or state association as to what happens next. State here says you have to sit next game. That is up to state to enforce. If you toss coach today he should sit next game. If you have his next game and he is there it is not your place to say he can't coach. Referee game and report. State, conference etc deal w him.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BigCat

U can toss her from the game and that's it. Up to school, league, and/or state association as to what happens next. State here says you have to sit next game. That is up to state to enforce. If you toss coach today he should sit next game. If you have his next game and he is there it is not your place to say he can't coach. Referee game and report. State, conference etc deal w him.

There may be an appeal in process. I don't know, and I don't care.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Adam

There may be an appeal in process. I don't know, and I don't care.

Sorry, I'm slow don't get it. I toss him. That's my job. State rules say he should sit next game but that's not up to me. I don't care if he is there or not for next game. That was my point to official. Referee and don't worry if he sits or not. Report it and let state deal with it.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by SD Referee

I think it is. A blatant 2 handed shove in the back will only lead to something worse later. That's not a basketball move or play. That's dirty. Get her out of the game.

That is what intentional fouls are for. Two hand shoves in the back are just that, usually.

[JRutledge]

I worked a game last night that had end lines that had nothing close to them within 15 to 20 feet. I am not so sure I would have called a flagrant if the very contact took place in my game last night.

Peace

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

That is what intentional fouls are for. Two hand shoves in the back are just that, usually.

I agree with you and an intentional or flagrant foul argument can be won on both sides.

Where I am from, I believe most officials would call this flagrant with a disqualification and that call would be supported.

I think that was a vicious 2 handed shove. Above and beyond other intentional fouls I have called. She's gone and she can take the rest of the game to think about it.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Sorry, I'm slow don't get it. I toss him. That's my job. State rules say he should sit next game but that's not up to me. I don't care if he is there or not for next game. That was my point to official. Referee and don't worry if he sits or not. Report it and let state deal with it.

That's my point. Some might want to get involved if they know it's the next game and they know the state rule. I'm still not, for the same reasons you mention. I just added that the coach may legitimately be able to coach while he appeals or something. Either way, my hands are off.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

A. Question: the OP says that White 15 was ejected from the game and from the tournament? Why from the tournament? Unless we are talking about her missing the next game as part of the consequence of being ejected from this game? I am assuming that is what is meant in the OP, but want to clarify in my own mind...as someone else already stated, we can disqualify the player from the game, but certainly have no authority to disqualify a player from the tournament.

It's called the super flagrant foul. It's right there in Rule 4.

Kidding aside, I just took that to mean that was the consequence imposed by the tournament organizer.