The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 04:10am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 2
Over and Back ?

NFHS rules:
A1 has a throw in along the sideline, the throw in touches A2 in A's front court and bounces into back court where it is touched by A3. Is it Over and Back?

I believe that when the rule was changed to create team control fouls the rule makers then had to rule that the ball was in team control during a throw in and thus this possibly changed the ruling to over and back. However, the rules now state that for it to be O & B the ball must first be in Team Control "in the front court." But a throw in is from out of bounds and therefore has no status.

It will be over and back if the touch by A2 establishes team control in the front court and is the last touch in front court all at the same time.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 05:28am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: In the offseason.
Posts: 12,260
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl M Johanson View Post
NFHS rules:
A1 has a throw in along the sideline, the throw in touches A2 in A's front court and bounces into back court where it is touched by A3. Is it Over and Back?

I believe that when the rule was changed to create team control fouls the rule makers then had to rule that the ball was in team control during a throw in and thus this possibly changed the ruling to over and back. However, the rules now state that for it to be O & B the ball must first be in Team Control "in the front court." But a throw in is from out of bounds and therefore has no status.

It will be over and back if the touch by A2 establishes team control in the front court and is the last touch in front court all at the same time.
No violation.

The NFHS really messed up the this area but has made it clear that there should be no change in the way backcourt violations are to be called.

There must be team control inbounds by the OLD definition of team control before the backcourt violation rules are in effect.
__________________
Owner/Developer of RefTown.com
Commissioner, Portland Basketball Officials Association
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 08:41am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,840
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karl M Johanson View Post
NFHS rules:
A1 has a throw in along the sideline, the throw in touches A2 in A's front court and bounces into back court where it is touched by A3. Is it Over and Back?

I believe that when the rule was changed to create team control fouls the rule makers then had to rule that the ball was in team control during a throw in and thus this possibly changed the ruling to over and back. However, the rules now state that for it to be O & B the ball must first be in Team Control "in the front court." But a throw in is from out of bounds and therefore has no status.

It will be over and back if the touch by A2 establishes team control in the front court and is the last touch in front court all at the same time.
They need verbiage to state that PC is required inbounds before any BC violation can occur.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 08:52am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 528
... and the title of this thread needs to be changed to "Backcourt?"

"Over and back" needs to disappear along with other hacky fanspeak phrases like "over the back," "reaching in," "on the floor," etc.

And sadly, these get a TON of use in our fraternity too
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 09:24am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: A little east of there.
Posts: 650
Quote:
Originally Posted by ODog View Post
... and the title of this thread needs to be changed to "Backcourt?"

"Over and back" needs to disappear along with other hacky fanspeak phrases like "over the back," "reaching in," "on the floor," etc.


And sadly, these get a TON of use in our fraternity too
Don't sweat the small stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 09:51am
NFHS Official
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by ODog View Post
... and the title of this thread needs to be changed to "Backcourt?"

"Over and back" needs to disappear along with other hacky fanspeak phrases like "over the back," "reaching in," "on the floor," etc.

And sadly, these get a TON of use in our fraternity too
I agree. "Over and back", just sounds bad.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 09:54am
High Five Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 669
Not to hijack but for those of you who don't like "on the floor", what do you use or prefer? I don't mind it. I know that every call technically happens "on the floor" but I still catch myself using it at times. I try to wave off and say "before the shot" but old habits die hard.


I wish I had a cool signature
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 09:55am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,840
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef View Post
Not to hijack but for those of you who don't like "on the floor", what do you use or prefer? I don't mind it. I know that every call technically happens "on the floor" but I still catch myself using it at times. I try to wave off and say "before the shot" but old habits die hard.


I wish I had a cool signature
I occasionally let "on the floor" slip out. But I also try "on the dribble", "before the shot", "no shot".
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:01am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,966
Oh, no! ANOTHER backcourt thread?

(Not a violation per NFHS interp.)
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:02am
NFHS Official
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,734
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef View Post
Not to hijack but for those of you who don't like "on the floor", what do you use or prefer? I don't mind it. I know that every call technically happens "on the floor" but I still catch myself using it at times. I try to wave off and say "before the shot" but old habits die hard.


I wish I had a cool signature
"No shot"
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:05am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,966
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef View Post
Not to hijack but for those of you who don't like "on the floor", what do you use or prefer? I don't mind it. I know that every call technically happens "on the floor" but I still catch myself using it at times. I try to wave off and say "before the shot" but old habits die hard.
"On the floor" is fanboy and wreck league talk.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:14am
High Five Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 669
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
"On the floor" is fanboy and wreck league talk.

Odd then that it continues in the vernacular of a LOT of referees.
Judgmental much?


I wish I had a cool signature
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:25am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,966
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef View Post
Odd then that it continues in the vernacular of a LOT of referees.
Judgmental much?


I wish I had a cool signature
And more often than not, those referees aren't working high-level games. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule.

Judgmental? Find me a camp that teaches officials that it's acceptable to say "on the floor."
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 10:46am
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 14,840
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
And more often than not, those referees aren't working high-level games. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule.

Judgmental? Find me a camp that teaches officials that it's acceptable to say "on the floor."
Camps I attend only care about that verbiage when the rule is being kicked. If the official making that ruling is correct, then observers/supervisors don't care.
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 16, 2015, 11:00am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: A little east of there.
Posts: 650
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
Camps I attend only care about that verbiage when the rule is being kicked. If the official making that ruling is correct, then observers/supervisors don't care.
I'm assuming you are referencing experiences at college level camps.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Back to Back Timeouts SCalScoreKeeper Basketball 4 Tue Jan 18, 2011 01:21am
Back judge - back pedal or turn and run stegenref Football 12 Sun Sep 12, 2010 08:23am
Over the back, ON the back RM article Nevadaref Basketball 32 Fri Feb 13, 2009 10:26pm
Over and back? Rita C Basketball 2 Sat Feb 04, 2006 11:01am
over & back or not johnfox Basketball 5 Sat Feb 04, 2006 01:47am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:04am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1