Ball-handlers / Freedom of Movement

[Rich]

So, how are things going with the rules around freedom of movement for ball handlers?

We had a boys varsity team yesterday who routinely commits 30+ fouls a game. And yesterday might have been the worst we've seen - they ended up with 39 fouls (the other team had 23). 68 free throws in the game. 4 of their players fouled out.

It's almost like they hope the officials will back down after a while rather than adjust their style of play. Maybe some do.

Gotta say, it wasn't the most fun I've ever had officiating.

[johnnyg08]

I've worked two boys games so far and in those games they cheated until we called them and we called them early. Then if they cheated again it was because they were tired.

Hopefully the players continue to adjust.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by Rich

So, how are things going with the rules around freedom of movement for ball handlers?

We had a boys varsity team yesterday who routinely commits 30+ fouls a game. And yesterday might have been the worst we've seen - they ended up with 39 fouls (the other team had 23). 68 free throws in the game. 4 of their players fouled out.

It's almost like they hope the officials will back down after a while rather than adjust their style of play. Maybe some do.

Gotta say, it wasn't the most fun I've ever had officiating.

OK for the most part. We try to get it early, and most of the time the players will adjust.

Had one the other night that got a little strange. We called a couple early and they settled down just fine. Then with about 3:45 left in the 4th it went to rat poop...all of a sudden they were hand checking right left and sideways - three starters from one team wound up fouling out. The only thing we could figure is that it's early in the season, they were getting tired and quit moving their feet.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

I've worked two boys games so far and in those games they cheated until we called them and we called them early. Then if they cheated again it was because they were tired.

Hopefully the players continue to adjust.

How did they cheat?

As for freedom of movement in my HS games, the coaches haven't been complaining when we call it on their teams. Apparently the VHSL has gotten the message across to them about what to expect, now it's just a matter of the players catching on.

[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

As for freedom of movement in my HS games, the coaches haven't been complaining when we call it on their teams. Apparently the VHSL has gotten the message across to them about what to expect, now it's just a matter of the players catching on.

I've noticed the same. VHSL = no surprises. But some of the non-VHSL games I do (VISAA, HRAC, etc.) = not so much. So like Rich was saying, we're calling the fouls in those games and some (not all) of the coaches are shocked. Had one chirping about a 9-4 foul count the other night, but the thing is we talked about the renewed emphasis on FOM via Rule 10-6 at the pre-game coaches conference! And his team didn't get it. So I politely reminded him about it, later I had to warn him, and as he was walking to the locker room at halftime....well let's just say we started the 3rd quarter with free throws. He still won by 21. Not on my Christmas card list.

On a more general note, two-hands is an easy black-and-white call (seen lots of those, usually when a defender starts to get beat and panics), and I've seen a few extended arm bars. But I haven't noticed to much hand-checking (hot stove or maintained hand). Seems like the players are only getting half of the message.

[JRutledge]

This is actually the same as it has been the last couple of years. Coaches know the rule basically and if we call it they either adjust or they sit. Really not much else to complain about. We still have a coach that wants every little touch a foul, but for the most part we ignore that and call what we think is a foul.

I have had games with a lot of fouls to games with hardly going into the bonus in the first half.

I also have been doing this for a longer time in college basketball, so I never had to be convinced as to what I should do as an official. I am pretty dug in at this point.

Peace

[BillyMac]

I called several hand checks in a scrimmage yesterday. No coach complained to me, and most yelled at their player, "Keep your hands off the ball handler".

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Will It Carry Over To The Regular Season ???

If we stay consistent and persistent.

And you guys are still doing scrimmages into December?

[bainsey]

So far, I'm seeing kids adapting. I'm having to call fewer second-half fouls than first-half ones.

Of course, in one game, I had Coach V complain we should've called more hand-checking fouls, while Coach H complained the fouls were 8-0 against his team.

[Dad]

Maybe I've just been lucky, but after 6 varsity games I have seen some major improvements. Only issue I've had, which was a sad one, was a star player in a great game picking up three stupid fouls(Hand checks).

Stuff going in the right direction:

1) Players adapt way faster to calls. After the first couple calls the games are clean.

2) Coaches stopped complaining about it except jokes, "I can't wait until January when this stops getting called." Less anger and more joking around is always good

3) Fans only yell, "Let them play!!" in the first quarter instead of riding us the entire game.

4) Officials seem to all be on the same page this year. Makes the games flow when we're all consistent.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

And you guys are still doing scrimmages into December?

State mandates: First game for girls can be no sooner than December 7, first game for boys no sooner than December 12.

We're still playing football. State semifinals are early this week.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

State mandates: First game for girls can be no sooner than December 7, first game for boys no sooner than December 12.

We're still playing football. State semifinals are early this week.

State semi-finals in football this weekend but public school basketball started on Nov. 30th, private schools started a 2 weeks before that.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

State mandates: First game for girls can be no sooner than December 7, first game for boys no sooner than December 12.

We're still playing football. State semifinals are early this week.

Girls basketball started November 16 for regular season games. Boys basketball started the week after on November 23.

Football State Finals for all classes are the weekend of Thanksgiving on Friday and Saturday. So the weekend before Thanksgiving was Semifinal weekend and the Boys were already practicing.

It can be done, both sports playing at the same time.

Peace

[SCalScoreKeeper]

Just finished working a varsity girls tournament and did a boys tourney before Thanksgiving.Seems like the kids and coaches here are getting the message and after a few called in the beginning they clean it up.Extended Armbar hasn't been all that much of an issue here it's primarily two hands on the ball handlers or handchecking.

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I called several hand checks in a scrimmage yesterday. No coach complained to me, and most yelled at their player, "Keep your hands off the ball handler".

I had a three-team scrimmage this past Friday and one team came out particularly aggressive on defense. I had to call 2-3 hand checks or arm bars early-on; at one point, I said "hands off the ball handler" after calling one. To their credit, the players adapted to to the calls.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

And you guys are still doing scrimmages into December?

Here, the girls season started this past week. Boys start tomorrow. My first HS level game is Tuesday. Let the fun begin.