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-   -   Help the basketball ref with the balk rule (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/98007-help-basketball-ref-balk-rule.html)

David B Fri Jun 06, 2014 09:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzy6900 (Post 935419)
If the LHP comes to a complete halt with that leg in the air - nothing moving - that's a balk. You can call it a double set or start & stop, but it's a balk. Now, if the LHP is real good, he'll be leaning forward and/or "curling up". Then, he better go to the plate.
I agree totally. Most of the time the pitcher uses the "hanging leg" to freeze the runner and continues to the plate.

But in the play, he went to the base - that would be a balk in my games.

Thanks
David

Kw parent Fri Jun 06, 2014 09:56pm
A different scenario
 
I was wondering if I could get feedback on a different scenario.

My son is a RHP.

With a runner on 2b he works out of the stretch. While engaged with the rubber he lifts his non-pivot leg in the normal fashion. While his non-pivot leg is coming up he turns his head (only his head) to check the runner. Then he turns his head back towards HP and completes pitch to the plate.

There is no pause or interruption in his movement. He just looks to 2b while in his movement.

Opposing coaches complain it is a balk but umpires disagree.

I am wondering if coaches might be right. It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration and it is deceptive because he can easily continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

Part 2 to this question comes from my son in the event the prevailing opinion is that it is a balk. That is, why is a slide step allowed because that is also an alteration of his normal movement.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.

Rich Ives Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kw parent (Post 935603)
I was wondering if I could get feedback on a different scenario.

My son is a RHP.

With a runner on 2b he works out of the stretch. While engaged with the rubber he lifts his non-pivot leg in the normal fashion. While his non-pivot leg is coming up he turns his head (only his head) to check the runner. Then he turns his head back towards HP and completes pitch to the plate.

There is no pause or interruption in his movement. He just looks to 2b while in his movement.

Opposing coaches complain it is a balk but umpires disagree.

I am wondering if coaches might be right. It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration and it is deceptive because he can easily continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

Part 2 to this question comes from my son in the event the prevailing opinion is that it is a balk. That is, why is a slide step allowed because that is also an alteration of his normal movement.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.
No rule requires that the motion be consistent.

No rule makes moving the head a balk.

A pitcher's job is to deceive. If he wasn't allowed to deceive he'd have to announce the pitch type and location. He just has to do it within the rules.

bob jenkins Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kw parent (Post 935603)
I am wondering if coaches might be right.
Stop wondering. They aren't. (as described)

David B Fri Jun 06, 2014 11:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kw parent (Post 935603)
I was wondering if I could get feedback on a different scenario.

My son is a RHP.

With a runner on 2b he works out of the stretch. While engaged with the rubber he lifts his non-pivot leg in the normal fashion. While his non-pivot leg is coming up he turns his head (only his head) to check the runner. Then he turns his head back towards HP and completes pitch to the plate.

There is no pause or interruption in his movement. He just looks to 2b while in his movement.

Opposing coaches complain it is a balk but umpires disagree.

I am wondering if coaches might be right. It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration and it is deceptive because he can easily continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

Part 2 to this question comes from my son in the event the prevailing opinion is that it is a balk. That is, why is a slide step allowed because that is also an alteration of his normal movement.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.
I don't understand what a coach would be complaining about - that just shows that their understanding of baseball is a minimum.

Have they never heard of Luis Tiant? He comes to mind…

As Rich stated, there is nothing in the rules that prevents what he is doing.
As long as he continues his motion to pitch he is fine.

Thanks
David

jicecone Sat Jun 07, 2014 07:09am
It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration and it is deceptive because he can easily continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

CORRECTION

It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration which is legal in the sport of Baseball. He is also allowed to continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

Out Sun Jun 08, 2014 01:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kw parent (Post 935603)
I was wondering if I could get feedback on a different scenario.

My son is a RHP.

With a runner on 2b he works out of the stretch. While engaged with the rubber he lifts his non-pivot leg in the normal fashion. While his non-pivot leg is coming up he turns his head (only his head) to check the runner. Then he turns his head back towards HP and completes pitch to the plate.

There is no pause or interruption in his movement. He just looks to 2b while in his movement.

Opposing coaches complain it is a balk but umpires disagree.

I am wondering if coaches might be right. It is not an interruption of his regular movement but it is an alteration and it is deceptive because he can easily continue pivoting to 2b in one movement and attempt a pick-off throw.

Part 2 to this question comes from my son in the event the prevailing opinion is that it is a balk. That is, why is a slide step allowed because that is also an alteration of his normal movement.

Thanks in advance for any guidance.
Your F1 is Good2Go. Play Ball! :)

JJ Sun Jun 08, 2014 01:53pm
Two words: Fernando Valenzuela.

JJ

Robert E. Harrison Mon Jun 09, 2014 09:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ (Post 935669)
Two words: Fernando Valenzuela.

JJ
I thought he looked toward heaven:rolleyes:

rcaverly Mon Jun 09, 2014 01:28pm
That was Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh.

Multiple Sports Wed Jun 11, 2014 01:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Ives (Post 935607)
No rule requires that the motion be consistent.

No rule makes moving the head a balk.

A pitcher's job is to deceive. If he wasn't allowed to deceive he'd have to announce the pitch type and location. He just has to do it within the rules.
Rich,

Great job of explaining that it IS the pitchers job to deceive !!!!

Rich Ives Wed Jun 11, 2014 08:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcaverly (Post 935709)
That was Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh.
Fernando did also.

Out Sun Jun 15, 2014 01:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert E. Harrison (Post 935689)
I thought he looked toward heaven:rolleyes:
Does it make any difference? :confused:

Spirit is everywhere! :cool:


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