The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Baseball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #31 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 09, 2014, 03:10pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,716
Quote:
Originally Posted by LRZ View Post
I don't know how "official" this is, but on Umpire-Empire, there's a post from Wendelstedt Umpire School. I don't know how to link to it, but here is the text:

"In determining whether a fielder drops the ball 'while in the act of making a throw following the catch' in accordance with Rule 2.00, the umpires will determine whether the fielder obtained possession of a ball in flight but dropped the ball while in the act of making a throw during the momentum of the catch. For example, if the shortstop, in an effort to turn a double play, throws to the second baseman, who drops the ball while in the act of drawing back his arm to make a throw to first base, the second baseman shall be adjudged to have had secure control of the ball and thus the ball shall be adjudged to have been caught by the second baseman. However, it shall not be adjudged to be a catch if, while in the act of making a throw during the momentum of the catch, the fielder loses possession of the ball in the transfer (e.g., flip from the glove) before he secures the ball with his throwing hand.

Our emphasis:
The 'flip' itself is not deemed a voluntary release, even though it may be a voluntary action. This is an update you will find in the 2014 Rules and Interpretations Manual. We have removed the exclusive interpretation offered for a number of year providing that it only be an attempted voluntary release. This is no longer the case. The release must be voluntary. Additionally, this interpretation has been merged with a tag of a base as well on the front end of a double play attempt. He must secure the ball in his throwing hand before it will be deemed secure possession was made."
Well I certainly hope they go back and change the definition part of a Catch in 2.00 "A CATCH is the act of a fielder in getting secure possession in his hand or glove of a ball in flight and firmly holding it... to and.
Reply With Quote
  #32 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 09, 2014, 03:22pm
Stirrer of the Pot
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Lowcountry, SC
Posts: 2,377
Quote:
Originally Posted by LRZ View Post
We have removed the exclusive interpretation offered for a number of year providing that it only be an attempted voluntary release.
I'll say it's exclusive. I've never heard of "attempted voluntary release" until now.
__________________
"Let's face it. Umpiring is not an easy or happy way to make a living. In the abuse they suffer, and the pay they get for it, you see an imbalance that can only be explained by their need to stay close to a game they can't resist." -- Bob Uecker
Reply With Quote
  #33 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 09, 2014, 07:25pm
Is this a legal title?
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 360
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
[COLOR="red"]And, if it's in any way "official" -- then I will change how I call it in many of my games.
Not me. This "interpretation" is in direct conflict with the letter of the rule. MLB is just making sh!t up now because they can.

Any fielder who closes his glove around the ball before he releases it without contacting the ground, another player, or a wall has caught it in my games.
Reply With Quote
  #34 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 09, 2014, 10:03pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Greensboro,NC
Posts: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Publius View Post
Not me. This "interpretation" is in direct conflict with the letter of the rule. MLB is just making sh!t up now because they can.

Any fielder who closes his glove around the ball before he releases it without contacting the ground, another player, or a wall has caught it in my games.
Exactly. And when you get to the show you'll call it the way MLB says call it!
Reply With Quote
  #35 (permalink)  
Old Thu Apr 10, 2014, 09:21am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Lincoln NE
Posts: 210
I got your back!

Quote:
Originally Posted by UMP45 View Post
Exactly. And when you get to the show you'll call it the way MLB says call it!
Or not and let the guys in NY change it for you.
Reply With Quote
  #36 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 11, 2014, 10:51pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Greensboro,NC
Posts: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert E. Harrison View Post
Or not and let the guys in NY change it for you.
So you will lack the nards to make the call right of wrong? Lazy!
Reply With Quote
  #37 (permalink)  
Old Sun Apr 13, 2014, 06:41pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 1,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by LRZ View Post
I don't know how "official" this is, but on Umpire-Empire, there's a post from Wendelstedt Umpire School. I don't know how to link to it, but here is the text:

"In determining whether a fielder drops the ball 'while in the act of making a throw following the catch' in accordance with Rule 2.00, the umpires will determine whether the fielder obtained possession of a ball in flight but dropped the ball while in the act of making a throw during the momentum of the catch. For example, if the shortstop, in an effort to turn a double play, throws to the second baseman, who drops the ball while in the act of drawing back his arm to make a throw to first base, the second baseman shall be adjudged to have had secure control of the ball and thus the ball shall be adjudged to have been caught by the second baseman. However, it shall not be adjudged to be a catch if, while in the act of making a throw during the momentum of the catch, the fielder loses possession of the ball in the transfer (e.g., flip from the glove) before he secures the ball with his throwing hand.

"Our emphasis: The 'flip' itself is not deemed a voluntary release, even though it may be a voluntary action. This is an update you will find in the 2014 Rules and Interpretations Manual. We have removed the exclusive interpretation offered for a number of year providing that it only be an attempted voluntary release. This is no longer the case. The release must be voluntary. Additionally, this interpretation has been merged with a tag of a base as well on the front end of a double play attempt. He must secure the ball in his throwing hand before it will be deemed secure possession was made."
First they say the release must be voluntary, then they say a transfer must be made to the throwing hand. And a flip is not a voluntary release? YGBSM. I have seen many "flips" that demonstrate complete control of the baseball including a voluntary and intentional release. They are making a mess of this.

And a catch has no momentum, the ball has momentum.
Reply With Quote
  #38 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 14, 2014, 08:46am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Lincoln NE
Posts: 210
Upon further review!

Quote:
Originally Posted by UMP45 View Post
So you will lack the nards to make the call right of wrong? Lazy!
I was just saying, than in the show, if you don't call it the way in which they have instructed, it will be overturned as we have repeatedly seen in the challenges thus far.

Last edited by Robert E. Harrison; Tue Apr 15, 2014 at 11:00am.
Reply With Quote
  #39 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 14, 2014, 09:11am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: NW PA
Posts: 146
In my opinion replay is really starting to do as much harm as good.
__________________
Hey Blue! Explain obstruction again.
Reply With Quote
  #40 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 14, 2014, 10:07am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 1,428
Quote:
Originally Posted by PABlue View Post
In my opinion replay is really starting to do as much harm as good.
I would rather see a rule requiring all disputes to be settled by the umpires on the field in one minute or less. Anyone not ready to resume the game after a minute is automatically ejected.

The other day I watched a replay of game 7 of the 1978 world series - Catfish Hunter vs. Don Sutton. 9 runs scored on 18 hits (21 baserunners). Time of game: 2:34.
Reply With Quote
  #41 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 14, 2014, 02:02pm
In Time Out
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 318
Baseball’s New Strategy: Drop the Ball on Purpose | FanGraphs Baseball
Reply With Quote
  #42 (permalink)  
Old Mon Apr 14, 2014, 02:45pm
Stirrer of the Pot
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Lowcountry, SC
Posts: 2,377
Wow. After seeing the video replays, I'm surprised that there hasn't been a backlash by MLB managers or players on the rule change. Were they even part of the decision process for the change? Or was this done unilaterally without their input?

BTW, I'm also surprised that Scioscia stayed in the game after Hamilton's play was reviewed and ruled a No Catch. Once a play is reviewed and a final ruling is made, managers should stay in their dugouts and not come out to get any clarification, IMO. They can ask between innings if they want, but not waste more game time.
__________________
"Let's face it. Umpiring is not an easy or happy way to make a living. In the abuse they suffer, and the pay they get for it, you see an imbalance that can only be explained by their need to stay close to a game they can't resist." -- Bob Uecker
Reply With Quote
  #43 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 15, 2014, 10:29am
Stirrer of the Pot
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Lowcountry, SC
Posts: 2,377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
Wow. After seeing the video replays, I'm surprised that there hasn't been a backlash by MLB managers or players on the rule change.
Hate quoting myself, but after posting this yesterday, I saw this today on the web. Maybe managers and players ARE getting a little frustrated with the change.

Rangers manager ejected for replay dispute | FOX Sports on MSN

http://m.mlb.com/video/topic/6479266...arguing-review
__________________
"Let's face it. Umpiring is not an easy or happy way to make a living. In the abuse they suffer, and the pay they get for it, you see an imbalance that can only be explained by their need to stay close to a game they can't resist." -- Bob Uecker

Last edited by Manny A; Tue Apr 15, 2014 at 10:39am.
Reply With Quote
  #44 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 15, 2014, 11:05am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 2,716
MLB inserted IR into the game and created another sceniaro to use it, with this new definition of "catch".

Amazing, just freaking amazing!!!!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #45 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 25, 2014, 02:49pm
APG APG is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,889
MLB clarifies rule on transfer of ball from glove to hand | MLB.com: News

__________________
Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some, given a chance to climb, they refuse. They cling to the realm, or the gods, or love. Illusions.

Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Thoughts on this release. bigjohn Football 27 Tue Sep 24, 2013 06:28am
Voluntary Release johnnyg08 Baseball 6 Mon Apr 27, 2009 10:51pm
voluntary release noleump Baseball 16 Mon Jan 28, 2008 09:11am
Voluntary Release Play... TussAgee11 Baseball 49 Thu Jul 26, 2007 11:37am
wing face off mid checking face off mid jdicqitdi Lacrosse 1 Fri Jun 08, 2001 05:38pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:53am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1