fair or foul

[xtremeump]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

What happened when the coach protested the incorrect application of rule?

(I also wonder what happened when UIC learned he has an umpire who would EVER say the word "Fair" out loud)

Never say never, I know it is never said but I had an Umpire that needed to say that's a fair ball in a Varsity ball game. The ball came off the bat over the dish and the F2 hopped up to get it and just threw the ball back to F1. The PU is pointing fair and nothing happened, so he yelled that's a fair ball...

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

Never say never, I know it is never said but I had an Umpire that needed to say that's a fair ball in a Varsity ball game. The ball came off the bat over the dish and the F2 hopped up to get it and just threw the ball back to F1. The PU is pointing fair and nothing happened, so he yelled that's a fair ball...

Then I'll stick with never. He should not have yelled a damn thing. Just stand to the side and point fair. Someone will get it eventually.

[john5396]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Then I'll stick with never. He should not have yelled a damn thing. Just stand to the side and point fair. Someone will get it eventually.

I agree with never, even with the little kids. Had a game years ago working 10-12yr old recreation. My partner was 16 year old kid, he was PU. bases loaded no outs. Pitch hits the knob of the bat and rolls 6 feet fair toward pitcher. No one moves. My partner correctly steps out from behind the plate and points fair. Cathcher walks over and picks up the ball. Coach yells "The ump wants the ball" so the kid walks to my partner who starts walking away from player trying to hand him the ball. Finally a parent yells "RUN". 2 outs and 2 runs later, I still don't know quite what happenned. But it was fun.

[xtremeump]

HTBT

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Then I'll stick with never. He should not have yelled a damn thing. Just stand to the side and point fair. Someone will get it eventually.

He said that's a fair ball... What is the punishment for breaking that rule and managing the game against your rule. I agree HTBT, I did not have a problem in that sitch???:

[RPatrino]

So you yell FAIR and everyone stops, because they don't expect to hear anything but FOUL. How do you handle that?

[xtremeump]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

So you yell FAIR and everyone stops, because they don't expect to hear anything but FOUL. How do you handle that?

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

"It's in play" or "In Play" is what I would say if no one was reacting to a ball despite my pointing fair and otherwise acting as if the ball was in play.

[RPatrino]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

The problem with this situation is, the ball was NOT in play. It was foul, and should STAY foul under FED rules. The PU had no rule based reason to say FAIR. Once a call of foul is made, the ball is DEAD, no longer in play. It cannot be made live again, there is no reincarnation of a dead ball.

If the rule set you are playing under allows that to be corrected, it is NOT corrected by telling everyone, "OK guys, start running!!" You place the runners where , in your judgement, they belong, had the ball not erroneously been called foul.

[Dave Reed]

Bob,
Read post #10. The thread evolved.....

[jicecone]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

"You tell me how to handle it ??? "

At a Varsity level game? Stand on the third baseline and point fair.

Consider it a lesson learned in what to expect, when you come on this site. It is not a" Perfect World" but, it is the "Real World".

[xtremeump]

Originally Posted by jicecone

"You tell me how to handle it ??? "

At a Varsity level game? Stand on the third baseline and point fair.

Consider it a lesson learned in what to expect, when you come on this site. It is not a" Perfect World" but, it is the "Real World".

Lesson Learned...

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do.

Continue pointing Fair. Eventually, somebody's gonna look at me and figure it out.

Yeah, verbalizing, "Hey fellas, that's a Fair Ball," or, "How long do I need to stand here and point until you realize that the ball is Fair," is a viable alternative. But it's certainly against approved umpiring mechanics. If you want to do that, go for it. You'll probably get the reaction you're hoping for. But just because some veteran umpire said that's what he would do, that doesn't mean it's proper.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

You stand to the side (not where PU stands for a pitch), point fair, and wait. If the players don't catch on, a coach or parent will eventually.

And this is not TWP at all - yours is not the first time this has happened in the history of baseball. Most of us have probably seen this 50 times, especially when working with the younger or less experienced groups ... but I've seen it once in high school ball. It happens. DO NOT YELL FAIR.

(You called your STATE INTERPRETER over this. Wow. I have no words.)

[xtremeump]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

You stand to the side (not where PU stands for a pitch), point fair, and wait. If the players don't catch on, a coach or parent will eventually.

And this is not TWP at all - yours is not the first time this has happened in the history of baseball. Most of us have probably seen this 50 times, especially when working with the younger or less experienced groups ... but I've seen it once in high school ball. It happens. DO NOT YELL FAIR.

(You called your STATE INTERPRETER over this. Wow. I have no words.)

I am sorry, next time I will contact you. I work very closely with my State Interpreter, my ASA UIC and even some wanna be district coordinators . Wow, I did not know just go on the forum where all of the experts are, behind a fake name with an I am correct and you are wrong BS.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by xtremeump

F1 had the ball BR was in the batters box PU was standing on the third baseline pointing fair and no one is doing anything. You tell me how to handle it ??? I know it never happens, but this play did happen. Please tell me what you would do. I agree do not verbalize FAIR BALLS but there are things that happen that have to be managed.This was a very good Umpire and has no problem getting good assignments. I really have a hard time with the way some people on this forum think that we live in a perfect world and that there is a black and white rule or mechanic for every game. I just talked with the State Interpreter and working 5000 plus games he said he had to say "Ball is in play" does that make anyone happy ??

With all due respect, your State Interpreter is: WRONG! WRONG! WRONG1

All rule sets, both baseball and fast pitch softball, the mechanic is the same: Point and verbalizes FOUL! And point FAIR!

Keeping pointing FAIR until someone gets it. A few years ago I had a USSSA girls' 12U fast pitch tournament game where I was the PU and the batter laid down a bunt that backspinned onto HP and stopped there. I pointed FAIR while the B/R and F2 just stared at the ball. Finally the B/R started runner toward 1B while F2 continued to look at the ball and then look at me while I kept pointing toward FAIR territory. The B/R made it to 1B before F2 finally picked up the ball and wanted to hand it to me.

Now the Defensive HC comes out and started to complain that I didn't tell his F2 that the ball was FAIR; keep in mind that not once did he yell to his F2 to pick up the ball and throw it to F3 at 1B. I told D-HC that I had in deed told his F2 that the ball was FAIR; I kept pointing toward FAIR territory. He proceeded that I was supposed to verbalize the word FAIR to which I told him no I am not. I also reminded him that all batted balls are FAIR unless the Umpires verbally state that they are FOUL. He then told me that his players didn't know that and that I should have taken that into consideration. I told him that no competent Umpire would do what he asked me to do and that players should be taught to play the ball until they hear the Umpires call FOUL, DEAD, or TIME. End of discussion.

Your State Interpreter needs to remember what I have highlighted in red.

MTD, Sr.