MLB: Beckham tag play on DeJesus

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Apparently we see different things in the video. Prior to contact, I see then runner foot make contact with the bag.

He is then knocked off with what instructors would call playing action, not an intentional shove or even an extra hard tag.

1) the tag itself did not knock DeJesus off the base. He had already gained a foothold on the base that withstood the initial tag.

2) the thing that knocked him off the bag was the body block that looked more at home in a hockey or football game than in the game of baseball. If the tag had knocked him off the base, I would agree with the out call. What's to stop all fielders from diving into runners after they're already called safe, just to get a cheap, undeserved out. This practice needs to be reevaluated, IMO.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

1) the tag itself did not knock DeJesus off the base. He had already gained a foothold on the base that withstood the initial tag.

2) the thing that knocked him off the bag was the body block that looked more at home in a hockey or football game than in the game of baseball. If the tag had knocked him off the base, I would agree with the out call. What's to stop all fielders from diving into runners after they're already called safe, just to get a cheap, undeserved out. This practice needs to be reevaluated, IMO.

The fielder tripped in the course of a normal baseball play. He didn't throw a block into the runner. Play on. Runner's out.

[DG]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

The fielder tripped in the course of a normal baseball play. He didn't throw a block into the runner. Play on. Runner's out.

I don't see a trip. I see a charge into the runner.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by DG

I don't see a trip. I see a charge into the runner.

While running to get into position to make the tag, the fielder, bent over, loses his balance and falls. (trips) The slow mo show this excellently.

If you want to see this as a deliberate dive into the runner, have it.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

While running to get into position to make the tag, the fielder, bent over, loses his balance and falls. (trips) The slow mo show this excellently.

If you want to see this as a deliberate dive into the runner, have it.

Why should it have to be deliberate? Fielders can fake a trip (aka 'acting') and dive right into the runner then. Oops, I tripped, sorry! The only thing that should be able to cause an out in these situations is the tag, not subsequent action. Had the tag dislodged his leg off the bag, I'd be right there with you. But not the fielder losing his balance...that's on him, not the runner. The runner should not be punished for the fielder's clumsiness.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

If you want to see this as a deliberate dive into the runner, have it.

I don't think it's deliberate. But I don't think the runner would have come off the base without getting knocked off.

Given the call on the field, you're obviously correct that this is how MLB calls this play. And ordinarily, I favor the defense. But it seems manifestly unfair to make the runner pay for this collision.

On the other hand, how many times do we see an incidental collision (esp. at the plate) and the ball pops out, runner safe? So maybe we go with this. :shrug:

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

The fielder tripped in the course of a normal baseball play. He didn't throw a block into the runner. Play on. Runner's out.

Tripped over what, his own two feet? I didn't see a trip, I saw a tag and then an off balance lunge at DeJesus. Out of control. Like DG said, a charge, which is what it looks like to me after watching it over and over many times. Very similar to a charging call in BBall, withe DeJesus establishing position on the base rather than in the lane. The tag had already come and gone unsuccessfully, the runner called safe, then the impetus of the collision knocked him off. I would rule safe on the play and let the Sox skipper come argue with me. And I'm a Sox Fan/Cub Buster when I slide my fanboy britches on.