batter accidentally kicks foul ball

[JR12]

On almost every thread on this site, you can find at least 1 post meant to belittle or ridicule someone. Aren't we all on the same team?

[DG]

I think the original post said he accidentally kicked. I don't know why that needs additional questioning.

Thank you rbmartin, posting should have stopped there.

[SAump]

OP is different. Ball is fair, moving down 1st base line. Runner is running behind the slow roller and makes contact with the ball before the ball has passed a fielder. Foul within batter's box and out further up the baseline.

[JR12]

Accidently= Foul Ball

[bigjohn]

pretty simple answer here. If the batter meant to kick the ball he is out, if the umpire reads his mind and see that he did not mean to kick the ball it was purely an accidental kick, foul ball!

I always heard no official can read minds, but the rule expect you to!

[Welpe]

Judging intent does not necessarily include reading minds.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Judging intent does not necessarily include reading minds.

It does, but we read each others' minds all the time. When I say "nice call," you read my mind (judge my intent) to speak sincerely or sarcastically. Every word we speak requires interpretation, which is a way of reading minds. Happens all the time, every day, and it's no big deal.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

pretty simple answer here. If the batter meant to kick the ball he is out, if the umpire reads his mind and see that he did not mean to kick the ball it was purely an accidental kick, foul ball!

I always heard no official can read minds, but the rule expect you to!

I love how you try to use one sport about a word and bring it immediately to another sport on a totally unrelated issue. Someone kicking something that they are not in control of or is not in their hand is very easy to identify as compared to where someone is trying to throw something. As a basketball official we do this determination all the time. A baseball is a smaller object and if someone is trying to kick a baseball while moving and may or may not be in their way to see what they are trying to do to contact it or not. And it is not really likely that a baseball is going to be kicked on purpose in many situations as it would possibly put that player in jeopardy of being called out and for contacting a live ball and players tend to realize that fact. Usually a batter is going to try to avoid getting hit unless the ball is obviously foul is not only unlikely for that situation to take place, it would be very rare to even take place in a single game based on all the sets of circumstances that would be needed to even have a realistic scenario of someone intentionally kicking a ball. A player in another sport that performs an act that is seen 50 times or more in a game is a little different to determine what is done intentionally to something that might not happen in 50 games an umpire might work. Batter trying to kick a ball on purpose would stick out like a sour thumb compared with all the things we have to do in a baseball game.

Peace

[David Emerling]

I found situation #3 particularly interesting:
Baseball rules corner: here's a quiz to test your knowledge of the rulebook - Brief Article | Baseball Digest | Find Articles

It says:

3. With Darin Erstad on second base for the Angels, a wild pitch eludes Toronto catcher Darrin Fletcher. The ball bounces toward the backstop and near the Blue Jays' ball boy. Trying to get out of the way, he accidentally kicks the ball and the runner takes an extra base to score. The umpire properly allows the play to stand. True or False?

Although the interpretation does not involve a player, I'm wondering if the philosophy holds true to players.

3. False. Even though the interference was accidental, a "kick" is considered intentional and the extra-base advance is nullified. Erstad should be returned to third. (3.15).

The reason I asked this question in the first place is because, somewhere in the recesses of my mind, I recall some interpretation like this - that if a player "kicks" a live ball, it is always considered intentional because it is too easy to mask an intentional kick with a seemingly "accidental", natural running motion. So, no matter how "accidental" it may have seemed - the fact of the matter is that runner kicked the ball as opposed to the ball simply hitting the runner. The runner actively did something.

But, like I said, I'm not sure of this.

You guys seem to think that, despite the runner "kicking" the ball, the umpire can still rule it as "accidental". OK - that seems reasonable enough.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I love how you try to use one sport about a word and bring it immediately to another sport on a totally unrelated issue. Someone kicking something that they are not in control of or is not in their hand is very easy to identify as compared to where someone is trying to throw something. As a basketball official we do this determination all the time. A baseball is a smaller object and if someone is trying to kick a baseball while moving and may or may not be in their way to see what they are trying to do to contact it or not. And it is not really likely that a baseball is going to be kicked on purpose in many situations as it would possibly put that player in jeopardy of being called out and for contacting a live ball and players tend to realize that fact. Usually a batter is going to try to avoid getting hit unless the ball is obviously foul is not only unlikely for that situation to take place, it would be very rare to even take place in a single game based on all the sets of circumstances that would be needed to even have a realistic scenario of someone intentionally kicking a ball. A player in another sport that performs an act that is seen 50 times or more in a game is a little different to determine what is done intentionally to something that might not happen in 50 games an umpire might work. Batter trying to kick a ball on purpose would stick out like a sour thumb compared with all the things we have to do in a baseball game.

Peace

Pretty sure I agree with everything in your very wordy post. But Jeff, how does a "sour thumb" stick out?