All Stars: Extension for coach's sons?

[Basebal1187]

I play in a Dixie Youth League in SC, and have done so for since I was 6, I'm now 15. Every year I have played, it seems the all star teams are made up of the same few kids, 95% of which are the coach's sons, and league official's kids. Only 2-3 of which actually deserve to be there.

From watching other nearby leagues, and playing them, it is evident we have quite a bit of talent in my league, and could have very good all star teams IF the "best" 15 or so were selected.

The all stars are selected by the coaches getting together at the end of the season and voting for the top 15 or so kids. Come all star season, the coaches will actually "campaign" amoung the other coaches for their vote for their son.

Although I can't really think of any other way to do it, I believe there is a better way. Perhaps the umpires, because we have the same crew the entire season? Or get the stats together and select that way? (if the books are kept correctly) The sad thing is that when the team is formed, the whole team is nothing but short stops, and people have to play out of position to form a team.. No thought is put into filling positions while forming the team.

Personally I wish they would quit with all stars all together.

I am mainly interested to find out if this is the way it is for other people as well... Because now even at the high school level, the politics of who your father is in the community, is very important.

[just another ref]

I have been a coach in Dixie Youth for the past several years. My son has made all-stars every other year, his second year in each league. Each time that he made it he was a unanimous selection, each time that he didn't make he failed to get any votes at all. Each time I thought that this was fair. I think that there are reasons why all star teams have many coaches children as members. The more talented players have more tendency to attract their parents' attention and interest, thus the parent is more likely to become a coach. Also, the more interested parents are more likely to work with a child and help develop the skills which make the player an all star. I have heard the complaints that you mention here in our league, too. Some are certainly worthy of debate, but people often see what they want to see, whether it be positive or negative. On the flipside, last year in our league the 11-12 all star head coach's 11 year old son failed to make the team. He accused me and the other coaches of a conspiracy to keep his son off the team so he would choose not to coach. I accused him of incoherent rambling. This year my team has all but wrapped things up so it looks like I will be head all star coach for the first time. We pick all stars Friday. I truly hope that my son does not get any votes because he simply does not deserve it. Anyone who thinks that this coaching thing is one big picnic should try it. I have one year left and would not have missed it for the world. Good luck to everyone's all stars and may the best team win in a game with no errors and no walks. (yeah, right)

[fguyton]

Originally posted by Basebal1187
From watching other nearby leagues, and playing them, it is evident we have quite a bit of talent in my league, and could have very good all star teams IF the "best" 15 or so were selected.

...

I am mainly interested to find out if this is the way it is for other people as well... Because now even at the high school level, the politics of who your father is in the community, is very important.

First, I've never been involved at any park or had friends at any park that did not have at least some issues around "Daddy-ball". Some are worse than others, but I don't think you ever really get away from it.

Our park had an issue with fielding All-star teams that were not the best kids so we formalized a process whereby each team could nominate 2 (maybe 3) players for All-star try-outs. From those 2 try-out sessions the All-star coach would select a team. Our park's All-stars (any age group) had never won our District tournament and rarely even managed to get to State. The first year of the new process we had 6 of 8 age groups win the District! Now I'm sure there were some other factors involved, not to mention coincidences, but in general I think it showed a lot of people what can happen if you look at the broader picture rather than just what's in it for you and your son.

[rpnetter]

While I agree that there should be a better way of choosing All-Star players I have yet to see one that works. Even the "Player Selection/Try-Out" method has it's faults because typically the Managers/Coaches who will run the team know that prior to the Try-Outs taking place and you fall into an even worse situation where now it is not 8-10 managers agreeing but 1-3 managers choosing. I have seen this type of behaviour first hand and it does irritate me quite a bit.

I have coached my own son for four seasons in which All-Stars were available and only sent him once. The problem is that most coaches I run into seem to feel that since they are volunteering so much of their time throughout the season that their child should get to play as many games as possible which means they go to All-Stars. I personally don't see any way to combat this perspective short of bringing in All-Star coaches that were in no way connected with the regular season and I don't know of a leauge that would consent to that drastic of an action even if they could find coaches/managers that would take the positions.

The bottom line is that as long as the league is made up of volunteers you are going to have this type of situation quite frequently.

[jicecone]

"Basebal1187"

I agree with you wholeheartly son, welcome to the world.
As long as kids games are organized and ruined by ego- driven parents, coaches, etc. This is going to happen. Truthfully though, there are probably many organizations where the kids do come first and the "I SYNDROME" does not prevail.

Let the kids pick the teams. Heck, they're the one's playing the games. I believe the competion would be just as good too.

When I coached the "AllStar Team", I actually had board members that suggested that their son's should be on the team because daddy was a board member. I even received a threating phone call from one board member that was also a police officer. Well I did'nt pick that kid and he called me to apologize for his father and agreed that he did'nt belong on the team. I will never forget that phone call.
The Boy went on to become a doctor and his Dad drank the rest of his life away. Sad, but true.

Don't be discouraged, keep fighting for things to be fair. Not only in youth Baseball , but in all things.

[Jerry]

Been there; done that.

A father's first responsibility is to his children; no matter how pitiful they are as ballplayers. Who gives a rip; none of 'em are gonna be Major Leaguers anyhow.

If someone doesn't care for whom you select to be on YOUR team . . . let them become a coach and get paid the big bucks for babysitting YOUR kids.

Neither of my kids were great, or even good, ball players. But both of them were, and continue to be, All Stars in my book!!!! If I have any influence on who's gonna be on my team, you bet your bootie my boys are on it!

Life's too short to worry about what other folks say/think. When my kids grow up (and they have) they'll know exactly why they were on the team . . . and why they'll put their own kids on the team when they grow up.

Jerry

[Basebal1187]

I'm sorry you feel that way. But when there are other kids that deserve to be there more than your own, like it or not, it's not right for your kids to be there instead of the ones who actually deserve it because of their ability.

In the real world you're not going to be there to get your kid a job or get them into college, so why baby them now?

[Jerry]

I feel sorry for your sons that their own father feels they're inadequate.

Jerry

[Basebal1187]

Well when I have a son (I'm 15), I will not put them somewhere or in a situation they did not earn. What does it teach them for you to put them on a team where they know they don't belong? Are you going to do this for them their whole life? And in no way is this a matter of making your son feel "inadequate." It merely teaches them that they will have to earn and work or everything in life, and that daddy won't be there forever.

[Jerry]

Let me guess. You weren't named to the All Star team, were you?

Jerry

[woolnojg]

Jerry -
Where do the major leaguers come from then? I thought they had to learn the game someplace, maybe I'm wrong. Somebody's kid grows up to be a major leaguer.

YOUR team? I always thought All-Star teams were the league's team.When did it become YOUR team?

Lookin' out for number 1, hey? Tends to make you a pile of number 2.

Baseball 1187 -
All-Stars have always been and always will be an exercise in politics. The process can be fairer than most but judgements will always have to be made. Some players I thought deserved such honors never got them, other people thought differently. Sometimes I'm right and sometimes not.

[Basebal1187]

Jerry, the "debate" if you will, was never about whether or not I made the all star team, and your comment has absolutely nothing to do with my original point, or question, which was wondering if anybody else saw these problems with the all star teams in their youth's baseball program. In doing this I was attempting to point out a level of ethics that coaches should have in selecting a team based on player's ability, not just an all star team.

[jicecone]

Lets see here, Basebal1187 is the young kid, and Jerry is the Adult.

Or did I get that mixed up?

Basebal1187, you got my vote for Father of the Year".

[bluezebra]

When in college, I was the Physical Instructor for a local city park in Chicago. My second summer there, I was asked to manage the Major division All-Star Team in city competition. I agreed. There were 12 teams, and each team sent three players to the tryouts. We could carry 18 on the playoff roster. I had to send 18 brokenhearted boys home. At the next BOD meeting, I cursed them out, as only a former Marine sergeant could do. I told them this was a stupid system. The reply was, "They're told they're trying out". I told them that as soon as the boy hears, "All-Star", everything else is shut out. They tell their parents, siblings, grandparents, friends, and anyone else who will listen.
I then told them, that if they wanted me to take the team next season, it would be on my terms. Since I watched ALL the games, and one of our umpires (he would be coaching with me) worked most of the games, we would do the choosing. We picked the best player at each position, then filled in, choosing at least one from each team.

Unfortunately, we lost our starting RH pitcher and SS before the playoffs. Doing some jockeying around with the positions, we lost the North side Championship in extra innings. My partner umped the City championship Game and was of the opinion that, with our full squad, could have won City.

But the main point is, there were no parents involved. There were no politics involved. The boys were happy, the BOD, managers and coaches, and the parents were happy.

Of course, this will not and cannot happen in a "regular" youth program.

Bob

[Jerry]

For Basebal1187:
If you were my son, son; and if I were the coach of the "All Star" team . . . you can bet your bootie you'd be on it. Doesn't matter to me that you have no talent and are hopelessly inept. I'm proud of you and, in my eyes the best and most talented kid on the team; heck; you're only gonna be in the field 1-inning anyhow. Let's hope nothing gets hit your way.

By the way . . . don't worry about all those other "real" ballplayers on the team. Since the beginning of time, the really talented players have never, ever committed an error, dropped a ball, struck out, or tripped over their own feet. Only the inept sons of coaches do that.

As for that "All Star Game" concept we were talking about . . . why not let every single kid in the league come up to bat at least once? And play at least an inning in the field? That way, not a single solitary parent can complain about how his/her little darling was left out.

My last word on this topic . . . I was a coach for only a couple of years; I'm a Dad forever. By the way, I didn't have any kids at the time I was coaching; so all the name-calling and criticizing sent my way recently has really been rather in vain.

Jerry