Balk?

[tankmjg24]

OBR rules - 12U league. RHP toes the rubber with his hands separated, glove by his left leg and ball in his right hand by his right leg. His free foot is closer to third than his pivot foot and there is roughly a foot between the two and the pitcher is completely upright. Upon coming set, the only part of his body that moves are his hands. His lower body stays still. Is this a legal pitching delivery or a balk. My partner and I feel as if it was a balk however the coach was adamant that this was legal. Thoughts?

Second part of the question is does the above ruling change depending on the rule set that is used?

[SanDiegoSteve]

You mean hands and arms, as in brings the hands together and doesn't move his non-pivot foot? If so, perfectly legal. What else is he supposed to move? There is no rule stating that he has to move his feet at all.

Second part: Same in all rule codes.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by tankmjg24

OBR rules - 12U league. RHP toes the rubber with his hands separated, glove by his left leg and ball in his right hand by his right leg. His free foot is closer to third than his pivot foot and there is roughly a foot between the two and the pitcher is completely upright. Upon coming set, the only part of his body that moves are his hands. His lower body stays still. Is this a legal pitching delivery or a balk. My partner and I feel as if it was a balk however the coach was adamant that this was legal. Thoughts?

Second part of the question is does the above ruling change depending on the rule set that is used?

More importantly, which provision of 8.05 does this violate? Which provision of OBR/FED/NCAA does this violate?

[tankmjg24]

My partner and I mistakenly thought that the free foot moving was part of the coming set action. This pitchers particular motion was also something that the majority of pitchers do not do so it just looked weird. Rather it is right or wrong an instructor one time taught me that if it looks awkward that something is probably not right.

Let me change it up a bit. What if the pitcher toes the rubber with his hands already together in the set position and just throws?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by tankmjg24

My partner and I mistakenly thought that the free foot moving was part of the coming set action. This pitchers particular motion was also something that the majority of pitchers do not do so it just looked weird. Rather it is right or wrong an instructor one time taught me that if it looks awkward that something is probably not right.

Let me change it up a bit. What if the pitcher toes the rubber with his hands already together in the set position and just throws?

Your first thought when you see the weird deliveries that FEEL like a balk, but you just don't know is... exactly which rule is being broken. Learn that section - know it - live it. You will come across a good number of screwy looking deliveries at the high school level. You need to know exactly what is allowed and what is not before deciding that something that looks weird is legal or illegal. the instructor that taught you that if it looks awkward something is probably not right has put your mindset in the wrong default position. The default position should be that the weird deliveries you come across are LEGAL, unless you know EXACTLY which part of the rule is being broken.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by tankmjg24

My partner and I mistakenly thought that the free foot moving was part of the coming set action. This pitchers particular motion was also something that the majority of pitchers do not do so it just looked weird. Rather it is right or wrong an instructor one time taught me that if it looks awkward that something is probably not right.

Let me change it up a bit. What if the pitcher toes the rubber with his hands already together in the set position and just throws?

1. F1 may do virtually anything as he comes set ("any natural preliminary motion" in 8.01(b)). He is not required to move his feet.

2. Prior to coming set, F1 must have one hand at his side or behind his back, with or without the ball. He cannot "toe the rubber" with his hands together. (8.01(b)) This is not a balk, but a "don't do that."

[dileonardoja]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

your first thought when you see the weird deliveries that feel like a balk, but you just don't know is... Exactly which rule is being broken. Learn that section - know it - live it. You will come across a good number of screwy looking deliveries at the high school level. You need to know exactly what is allowed and what is not before deciding that something that looks weird is legal or illegal. The instructor that taught you that if it looks awkward something is probably not right has put your mindset in the wrong default position. The default position should be that the weird deliveries you come across are legal, unless you know exactly which part of the rule is being broken.

+1

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by mbyron

1. F1 may do virtually anything as he comes set ("any natural preliminary motion" in 8.01(b)). He is not required to move his feet.

2. Prior to coming set, F1 must have one hand at his side or behind his back, with or without the ball. He cannot "toe the rubber" with his hands together. (8.01(b)) This is not a balk, but a "don't do that."

If it's momentary adjustment (As Evans calls it in the balk video), it's not even that, it's completely legal.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by zm1283

If it's momentary adjustment (As Evans calls it in the balk video), it's not even that, it's completely legal.

I'm not sure we're imagining the same action.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by zm1283

If it's momentary adjustment (As Evans calls it in the balk video), it's not even that, it's completely legal.

While Jim makes that statement, it is not regarding toeing the rubber with one's hands already together.