New ump in Little League

[mick]

I had a fine time with a young umpire, who was working his first plate game, last night. Each ½ inning we covered something of the following:

Pre-game conference,

ManagerÂ’s meeting,

had a couple of game management situations where we had to talk to one or both coaches,

the infield fly and signals,

adjusting the Zone for different levels,

confidence and presence of the umpire,

not verbalizing on a swinging strike,

obstruction vs. interference,

umpires' equipment purchases,

how to show strikes and balls,

umpire discussions with and without coaches and players around,

when to get paid or fill out the paperwork,

how to demand using a polite question,

the importance of concentration and fluids.

After the first ½ inning, this young man (16) started adapting and learning and his confidence and presence grew by each 1/2-inning. He was a willing student and enjoys umping.

It was good.

[BJ Moose]

1. You talked EVERY half inning? ugh
2. You talked about how to get paid during the game? ugh
3. You talked about the pregame conference DURING the game? ugh
4. ugh
5. So, now does he think it is OK to come in and BS during every half inning?

[Striker991]

I agree with BJ that 1/2 innings are for paying attention to the activity on the field and/or doing substitution paperwork and NOT for umpire lessons or BS'ing with your partner. Communication with your partner should be limited between innings to only NECESSARY conversation. All that other stuff should have been taken care of in your pregame with your partner or discussed for learning after the game. I am also curious why you are accepting pay to do LL work? Better yet, why are the leagues paying umpires for LL, especially UNTRAINED ones? It is a volunteer organization.

[mick]

Originally posted by BJ Moose
1. You talked EVERY half inning? ugh
2. You talked about how to get paid during the game? ugh
3. You talked about the pregame conference DURING the game? ugh
4. ugh
5. So, now does he think it is OK to come in and BS during every half inning?

Actually, we talked about getting paid after he went to the payer, after the game.
It was the lad's first plate game and each time it was brief; it didn't take the entire one minute of the player change.

[mick]

Originally posted by Striker991
I agree with BJ that 1/2 innings are for paying attention to the activity on the field and/or doing substitution paperwork and NOT for umpire lessons or BS'ing with your partner. Communication with your partner should be limited between innings to only NECESSARY conversation. All that other stuff should have been taken care of in your pregame with your partner or discussed for learning after the game. I am also curious why you are accepting pay to do LL work? Better yet, why are the leagues paying umpires for LL, especially UNTRAINED ones? It is a volunteer organization.

No, Striker991.
I would not consider LLBB to be a totally volunteer organization. Though many of us volunteer, many more receive money in this area.

I was asked to help the young ump, by him and by his assignor, and I was happy to accomodate. Watching him mature as the game progressed was a good thing.
mick

[Striker991]

From the LL Rulebook:

"There is no sound reason for paying umpires..."

I hope you either turn back your fee or donate it.

[mick]

Originally posted by Striker991
From the LL Rulebook:

"There is no sound reason for paying umpires..."

I hope you either turn back your fee or donate it.

Striker991,
Does the rule book say there shall not be paid umpires?
Umpires either get paid, or they do not get paid.
What exactly is your point?
Why would you hope that I turn back a game fee that I got, or did not got?
mick

[Striker991]

Little League is an organization that is for the kids to learn baseball, have fun, learn character, and to build community. At the local level everyone else is volunteer. Why should umpires get paid? Every dollar you take is a dollar taken away from a child that may not be able to afford to play. It is money taken away from better equipment and better facilities. Why do you think you should get paid?

[mick]

Originally posted by Striker991
Little League is an organization that is for the kids to learn baseball, have fun, learn character, and to build community. At the local level everyone else is volunteer. Why should umpires get paid? Every dollar you take is a dollar taken away from a child that may not be able to afford to play. It is money taken away from better equipment and better facilities. Why do you think you should get paid?

Striker991,
Why the third degree?
Have you ever been a Little League umpire?
Are you a Little league umpire?
Where did I say I think I should be paid?
mick

---

That dog don't hunt.

[JEL]

I think you should be paid. I was hoping to retire after my first year of Dixie League, but I guess I'll have to go at least another one! Why should umpires be paid? We perform a service which requires us an outlay of cash, uniforms, equipment, clinic costs, etc. It is not a way to get rich for sure, but expenses should be covered. I am speaking of local rec dept, ball is paid for by taxes, and players only pay $35.00 a season, (waived if not affordable). Would I donate my time? I have for several years.

[Striker991]

Mick

I am a little league umpire. I am very active in my district, and work with a volunteer umpires association that does nothing but Little League, as well as doing games for our local Little League. As I cannot do games the first week of every month because of my occupation, I have only done about 40 games this season. I do anything from majors to seniors, both softball and baseball.

Your quote:

"Actually, we talked about getting paid after he went to the payer, after the game."

I am making the assumption that "we" refers to both of you. Since you do get paid, I assume that you feel that you should get paid.

Again, no third degree. I am just stating that at the local level, Little League IS a volunteer organization. No one else gets paid, why should umpires? Compared to fund-raising, coaching, managing, being on the board, etc, time involved in umpiring is relatively small. That's why I chose umpiring over the other volunteer positions available.

We all have opportunities to make money umpiring for other organizations (ASA, City Rec, Babe Ruth, High School, College, State Junior, etc). We umpire Little League to support our communities and our kids. We shouldn't get paid. We are supported in other ways, though, like District rules and mechanics clinics, payment of tuition to Regional camps, a cheeseburger and a coke, bottled water, etc.

Don't take money from the kids whose only opportunity and exposure to baseball is through Little League. Many of these kids wouldn't be able to play without it, as their skill level or financial level wouldn't allow them to be competitive in other leagues.

We are a small district, yet 25% of our umpires have been chosen at one time or another to participate in regional tournaments. And, we are ALL volunteer.

Jel:
By your thinking, all positions in Little League should be paid. Come to think of it, all positions in all volunteer organizations should be paid. The purpose of volunteering is to provide services that would otherwise have to be paid for and would take away funds that could do much more good elsewhere. If you think you should be paid, fine. Work city league, or Babe Ruth, or State Junior, or High School, or ASA, and on and on and on....just don't work Little League and expect payment.

[JRutledge]

I am a little league umpire. I am very active in my district, and work with a volunteer umpires association that does nothing but Little League, as well as doing games for our local Little League. As I cannot do games the first week of every month because of my occupation, I have only done about 40 games this season. I do anything from majors to seniors, both softball and baseball.

Nothing wrong with that. But understand that it does not apply to all areas.

Your quote:

"Actually, we talked about getting paid after he went to the payer, after the game."

I am making the assumption that "we" refers to both of you. Since you do get paid, I assume that you feel that you should get paid.

What is wrong with that?

Again, no third degree. I am just stating that at the local level, Little League IS a volunteer organization. No one else gets paid, why should umpires? Compared to fund-raising, coaching, managing, being on the board, etc, time involved in umpiring is relatively small. That's why I chose umpiring over the other volunteer positions available.

Do you think the Park Districts do not get compensated for LL using their facilities? You think the Electric Company says, "we know you are a volunteer organization, you will not pay us any money to run the lights for your league? Or do you think the Water company says, "we do not take money from volunteer organizations?" I think you know the answer to that.

We all have opportunities to make money umpiring for other organizations (ASA, City Rec, Babe Ruth, High School, College, State Junior, etc). We umpire Little League to support our communities and our kids. We shouldn't get paid. We are supported in other ways, though, like District rules and mechanics clinics, payment of tuition to Regional camps, a cheeseburger and a coke, bottled water, etc.

If you take that premise, we could say that all those levels help our kids too. Umpires are independent contractors in most situations. I have never been a member of Little League when I was doing it. I actually worked for the local Park District who provided the umpires for all the Park District game affiliated levels, many you listed.

Don't take money from the kids whose only opportunity and exposure to baseball is through Little League. Many of these kids wouldn't be able to play without it, as their skill level or financial level wouldn't allow them to be competitive in other leagues.

When LL does not have to pay everyone else for services used, then I and other umpires might consider your plea. But until then, that is what fundraisers should be trying to accomplish, paying the umpires to do a job.

We are a small district, yet 25% of our umpires have been chosen at one time or another to participate in regional tournaments. And, we are ALL volunteer.

And that is wonderful for those that want to do any tournament level ball. But for those that might do LL every once in a while, that might not make sense.

Jel:
By your thinking, all positions in Little League should be paid. Come to think of it, all positions in all volunteer organizations should be paid. The purpose of volunteering is to provide services that would otherwise have to be paid for and would take away funds that could do much more good elsewhere.

I think you are taking the volunteer role too far. Little League, just like any other organization pays people to do jobs that benefit the organization. I am sure if a field is built to play on, they folks that build it do not do it all for free.


If you think you should be paid, fine. Work city league, or Babe Ruth, or State Junior, or High School, or ASA, and on and on and on....just don't work Little League and expect payment.

If you do not want to take money, you do not have to. But please do not expect everyone to take your position on this issue. If you ask me you position is rather shortsighted. Because you are also not taking into consideration, if umpires are not expected to ever get paid with LL, they will go to other leagues to accomplish getting paid. Then you might have no one to umpire LL at all. One of the many reasons I personally do not do it anymore. With all the headaches LL already provides to the average umpire, suggesting they not get paid is not looking a the big picture in my opinion.

Peace

[Jay R]

That reminds me of a post from the basketball board where someone decided to volunteer to ref kids at a low level. He figured since it was volunteering, he would get less flak from coaches, parents. He quickly decided there was too much grief to do it for free. Later, when those same refs started charging for their services, the coaches etc... were more respectful towards the officials. Food for thought.

This is my first year umpiring. In fact, this week, I had a game similar to Mick's story. A veteran umpire worked with me. We pregamed for 30 minutes, met between half-innings (I realize you do not do this on a regular basis) and talked in the locker room after the game for another 45 minutes about various rules and mechanics. This is so valuable for young guys when veterans share their knowledge and experience.

By the way, I have invested some $600 in umpire gear. I would not have done that if we did not get paid.

[mick]

Originally posted by Jay R

... I have invested some $600 in umpire gear. I would not have done that if we did not get paid.

Jay R,
Our local league provides the umpire equipment for the young/new umpires, but not the apparel.
Catching an umpiring check has allowed some of them to buy their own stuff, to upgrade the equipment they use. Having your own stuff is a big ego boost.
If you look good, you feel good, you work good.
Good luck with umpin' !
mick

[mick]

Originally posted by Striker991
I am a little league umpire. I am very active in my district, and work with a volunteer umpires association that does nothing but Little League, as well as doing games for our local Little League. As I cannot do games the first week of every month because of my occupation, I have only done about 40 games this season. I do anything from majors to seniors, both softball and baseball.

Good goin' Striker,
I've been involved in LLBB for 16 years in each position of our local league.

Your quote:

"Actually, we talked about getting paid after he went to the payer, after the game."

I am making the assumption that "we" refers to both of you. Since you do get paid, I assume that you feel that you should get paid.

Had you made the assumption that, in lieu of having made other agreements, an ump should be paid up front and before the game at most levels, and that this young/new ump went to the managers to have his voucher signed after the game while I waited to post-game, you would have been accurate.


Again, no third degree. I am just stating that at the local level, Little League IS a volunteer organization. No one else gets paid, why should umpires? Compared to fund-raising, coaching, managing, being on the board, etc, time involved in umpiring is relatively small. That's why I chose umpiring over the other volunteer positions available.

This is a big country, like Rut said. All districts are not equal, and in each district, the local leagues make their own choices with regard to writing checks for umpiring.

We all have opportunities to make money umpiring for other organizations (ASA, City Rec, Babe Ruth, High School, College, State Junior, etc). We umpire Little League to support our communities and our kids. We shouldn't get paid. We are supported in other ways, though, like District rules and mechanics clinics, payment of tuition to Regional camps, a cheeseburger and a coke, bottled water, etc.

I agree that working in other leagues is a great way to get paid, buy your stuff, and still be able to volunteer at the little league level. But young/new umpires may not know whether they enjoy umpiring and/or they may not even be asked to work the upper leagues until they get that LL experience and are then "discovered".

Don't take money from the kids whose only opportunity and exposure to baseball is through Little League. Many of these kids wouldn't be able to play without it, as their skill level or financial level wouldn't allow them to be competitive in other leagues.

Again, paying LL umps is a local league decision. Neither is right; neither is wrong. Our local league budgets for paid umpires. Your league does not. When there are too many kids, another team is created.

We are a small district, yet 25% of our umpires have been chosen at one time or another to participate in regional tournaments. And, we are ALL volunteer.

Now, I assume. I assume that since such a high percentage of your umpires have worked regionals, that you are very near, or in, Indianapolis, Bristol, St. Pete, Waco or San Bernardino. Our District 11 is 600 miles from Indy. I think we have only had 4-5 umps work the region. My buddy was honored as the LL volunteer of the year 2-3 years ago.
mick