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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 02:05pm
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We've all had them once or twice. He (or she) isn't just a heckler, but takes it way beyond that. The fan that knows he or she is protected by the chain link.
These people are the ones that when in a major league ballpark you see security walking them to the door. Unless you are working D level there is no campus security. Oh, sometimes in FED ball you'll see school district security hide out at a game for awhile but they are just there because they are goofing off, rather than completing appointed rounds. I'll give a situation that I blew this summer and see what you guys would have done. Fist week Sandy Colfax season. Age unknown just Sandy Colfax. I'm in the salad with a young experienced fella at the dish. We had this fan that was unbelievable, major whining on every call, claiming balk on about every other pitch. If there were a banger he'd almost climb the fence in his protesting. When it got to the point of getting his fellow fans involved my Pard started loosing it. Then Pard popped the coach. Have you ever seen the movies where in a prison riot the angry mob is all pushed up against the fence? After the game it didn't settle down until THE FAN had driven away. Young fella was to the point of calling him out etc. etc. Just a plane old ugly situation. I blew it because all I did was try to settle everybody down. The action I should have taken I didn't learn about until I started surfing the net. What I'd do today is only one tool that I have to use. There must be a lot more. Buy the way in our assoc. we're not SUPPOSED to pop a fan. Although I have heard rumors of the stands being totally cleared. rex 
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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 02:43pm
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First of all, for the most part, I try not to hear anything coming from the other side of the screen, BUT if the guy is really loud and obnoxious to the point of being a total distraction to me or to stirring up the other fans then I will invoke an "expanded" interpretation of 5.10(a) and suspend the game. I will then call both managers over and tell them both that the game will not continue until the troublemaker(s) are out of sight and sound of the field. After that I'll stand there and let them deal with the guy.
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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 03:38pm
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We had 2 situations with your hot hades hellion. In the first one he said some unkind, injudicious words of disagreement. Blue dumped him, and held up the game till he was gone.
In the second one, us fans took care of it. We invited those 2 to leave. NOW!! So see, some fans look out for blue.. Bob
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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 03:56pm
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by rex:
When it got to the point of getting his fellow fans involved my Pard started loosing it. Then Pard popped the coach. First off Rex your Pard needs to attend a clinic on Game Control as things shouldn't have gone this far. At the first sign of heckling, since your partner is a "rookie" you should have gone over to one of the coaches and tell him the situation. Either this fan cools it or he will be asked to leave. Chances are the caoch knows who it is. If the coach can't calm this person down, then this person needs to be removed from the field before play continues. If you have to call the authorities and have them remove him. Do not resume game until this matter is resolved. If the heckling involves more than one fan and you feel things could get really ugly, then simply suspend the game. Call the assignor and tell him what happened. Pete Booth
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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 08:17pm
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Preventative Officiating
We've all heard those words. But in the area we are discussing, most umpires, leagues, and associations don't practice preventative officiating. I, for the life of me, can't figure out why that is. Many umpires complain about abuse. Some of them have legitimate claims. But others don't bother to take the easy steps that will prepare for when a fan goes ballistic (or, for you Generation X-ers, "postal.") It is impertaive that every league sets up a system for dealing with irate fans. As has been said, in most places, baseball games simply do not get police coverage. It is up to the leagues to have a system for dealing with this problem. For example, in one league I work, the home team is responsible for fan disorder. If the fans get unruly, the coach had better get in gear. If he doesn't know what to do, then you run him and see if his assistant can think of something. It's that simple. Usually they go talk to the fan and things get quieted down. Other times the police are called. In Little League, the Board of Directors is responsible for creating this type of system. Usually, there are league officers present at every game. If a fan gets out of hand, that league officer is charged with the duty of controlling the problem. If no such system exists in your league, make it your association's top priority to hound that league until it does. Then, every umpire must be informed of the different policies. It is an umpire's responsibility to know what to do when a fan is out of control. Don't neglect this area. Go out and find out what you are to do. If you don't the kinds of horror stories we have heard will happen to you. Sincerely, Jim Porter
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Mon Sep 11, 2000, 08:19pm
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quote: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Rex, I learned a good way to deal with these idiots. We don't have much of a problem at our fed level, ad's are required to attend. At our PONY games, I will usually find a league official or ranking coach who is not a member of competing teams to be my "security force". Example, working a Bronco level all-star invitational tourney, I had this one parent not only ripping my pard but also the coaching staff.Betwen innings, I had enough of this fool. I called for some game balls, quietly pointed offender out and poof, he was escorted from the stands. The moral of this is, if ya gotta run a fan, don't let it be known it was the ump. Sometimes that will bleed off to other fans and a real crap house ensues.....chris
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Tue Sep 12, 2000, 08:52am
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I had the plate for a 13 year old Ruth game this year. There was this "fan" who did not heckle us the umpires but heckled players from BOTH teams. Finally around the 3rd inning I had enough. I called time, walked over to the stands (there was only stands on 1 side, so both teams fans were on the same side- another potential pblm) and I looked right at him and said "sir, These kids are here to learn, encouragement is fine, but stop what you are doing right now or I will stop this game and ask someone to call the local police and remove you from the stands". The others in the stands started clapping and the guy actually stopped. I have to admit that I was lucky and it could have gotten uglier, but sometimes it you let that out of control fan know that he/she is acting like a jerk, they MAY stop. What I still can't figure out is why nobody in the stands or either coach stood up for there sons and told this guy to shut up !
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Wed Sep 13, 2000, 12:49am
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Not the recommended approach by any stretch of the imagination.
A few years ago, one (LL)base ump in my town stopped the game and walked to the bleachers. He sat down, paused, and said "You're right - the view is better from here. Play ball!" He called two plays from the stands and then went back to the field. No problems for the rest of the season, but the story will live on for quite a while. -Kono
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Wed Sep 13, 2000, 09:11am
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I am pretty much amazed that some of you actually feel necessary to interface with a crowd member as you have listed above.
First, I have never worked a small diamond game so I offer no input on that level, however, I do work FED, College, American Legion, College Wood Bat and a very few adult games. With the exception of a 'drunk and disorderly" fan I cannot picture how it could be my right or responsibility to eject a fan. If the fan is taunting players . . . I would expect the coach or league representative to handle it. If the fan is taunting an umpire . . . well friends, that just comes with the territory. Now don't get me wrong . . . in my early days I have offered to go behind the dugout with a fan or two and "settle things like a man", but you kow what - I was wrong. It is our JOB to handle players, coaches, and our feloow umpires - NOT to worry about the hyped up father of the 16 year old picture that thinks he is the next Sandy KOUFAX (not Colfax). Pull up your socks guys. ------------------ Strikes & Outs
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Wed Sep 13, 2000, 04:06pm
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quote: I totally agree with you T. But when a fan crosses the line, we must know who to go see to rectify the problem. In my experience, when someone goes beyond just normal heckling, and crosses the line, no one deals with that person (or people.) It gets ignored and, eventually, out of hand. No umpire should approach an out of control spectator. You're just asking for trouble when you do that. If you really have a problem, know who should take care of that problem, whether it is a league official, coach, concession manager - whoever. Sincerely, Jim Porter Youth League Correspondent eUmpire.com [This message has been edited by Jim Porter (edited September 13, 2000).]
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Wed Sep 13, 2000, 04:09pm
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Most of the games I do are competetive PONY games 13-14 year olds on an 80 foot diamond. Parents still think their kid is a future hall of famer and all, but I've been in this league long enough (7 years) that they know not to get on my case. Oh, did I mention I'm 19 years old? Anyway, when teams from other towns come and start causing problems, I'll take my mask off between innings, and slowly walk towards that side of the fence, saying nothing, but staring directly at the fan. I'll stop and turn, close enough so that the fan can say something if s/he wants, but far enough so s/he can touch me. If they keep going, I'll go tell the coach to deal witht he fan-it works every time. Or I dump the coach...it is HIS job to control the fans, not mine
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Wed Sep 13, 2000, 08:06pm
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Sorry; but, I have to totally disagree. By way of definition: Taunt = to provoke with insults; and, Heckle = to harass.
Hardly, what one could call, good sportmanship! Spectator = observer, onlooker, audience, patron,witness. Now, with sportsmanship allegedly being first and foremost in most youth programs - the taunter/heckler/ie. loudmouth goes!!! I've yet to see this type of issue resolve itself when an umpire just ignores it, mind you I'm not saying the umpire should directly confront the source of the problem. (jmo) quote:
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Thu Sep 14, 2000, 12:06am
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Allow me to relate a story that has gone around our local baseball association. The umpire I write about is a close friend of mine.
Legion game, my umpire friend is doing his second game behind the plate on a 95+ degree day. Two 80 year old men are in the stands directly behind home plate. The first game, they have given my friend h*ll about his outside corner on every cloas pitch. The second game in the 3rd or 4th inning, my friend had enough. He called timeout, went back to the fence, and had a conversation like the following: Umpire: Gentlement, how far is that fence from home plate? Two Old Men: UHHHH?? Umpire: 50 feet. And how far back are your seats from that fence? Two Old Men: UHHHHH??? Umpire: About 10 feet. How wide is that plate? Two Old Men: UHHHHH??? Umpire: 17 Inches. Ang gentlemen, how wide is my a**? NOTE: My friend is by no means thin. In fact he is slim-challenged:-) Two Old Men: What? Umpire: How wide is my a**? Two Old men: I, Uhhh? Umpire: A whole lot bigger than that plate. Now you are trying to tell me that you can see around my a**, 60 feet, and call the corners for me? If you can then you are better at this than me. If not, shut your mouths and let's play some ball. Rest of Crowd: Cheers and satisfaction that these two men were just put in there place. Moral to this story: I don't think there is one. I just thought I would give an example where dealing with a fan was a positive experience for one umpire. www.umpire.org has an excellent article on this subject.
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Thu Sep 14, 2000, 08:58am
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Not that I am one to disagree with T. Alan on anything, but as I have gotten older and more experienced the case of "rabbitt ears" that i had when I started has pretty much gone away. I actually amazed myself this season with the I handled the crap dished out. 0 player/coach ejections. But since I was convinced (coerced, bribed, begged) to work a youth summer league with known fan/player/coach discipline problems......I had the pleasure of interacting with a drunk dad....a drunk/high mom......a whole flock of beligerant grandparents.........intent on having it out with the new Umpire.....I think by the end of 12 weeks of games, we had 10 fans removed by coaches/police.......held up games until bad behavior ceased and left the program in better shape. Just a story...standing behind the backstop I heard a coach talking to a fan in the stands...the fan was bragging on how he had berated the umpire in the teams last game....coach told him "better keep your mouth shut tonight with these Umpires, or you wont be here to see the game".........not a peep out of him, no comments from me..........
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