Is whining & *****ing more prevalent this year?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by yawetag

Dave was simply saying that if the only basis of a balk is "I was surprised by the move he made," it's not always a balk.

I believe Dave would go so far as to say if that's the ONLY basis, it's NEVER a balk.

[KJUmp]

Dave....thanks for hijacking what started out as an excellent thread by Ump25 about the bit****ng and moaning that we're all subjected to by idiot coaches.

It never ceases to amaze me how when a the OP is a good thread about apples, and oranges get mentioned in passing, someone feels the need to shift the discussion to oranges. Dave, if you want to talk about angles and how they should be applied in determining balks....start a new thread.

BTW, I think it's safe to assume that Ump25 knows a thing or two about balks at the college level, wether the game is being played under NCAA or OBR rules.

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by yawetag

Yes, but it's not the surprise factor that made it a balk; it was the illegal act that did.

Obviously, it takes some illegal act to make it a balk.

Really??? Wow. I never knew that.

[billken]

Until Honigs starts selling protractors, we are faced with a judgment call.

I've had a coach come out on me and argue that he had 45 degrees as he pointed to the divot that the pitcher's front foot made when he picked the kid off at 3rd. I told him that I didn't have a protractor to determine if it was 44 degrees or 46 degrees, so he was just going to have to live with my call.

The bottom line is that the 45 degrees is a thumb rule, but the actual rule says "directly". If a kid is "fudging" the line, he puts it in my hands and he might not like the outcome. If he will not try and get away with the maximum allowable and step at 35 degrees (a point that is clearly more toward the base than the plate), then he takes me and my judgment out of the equation.

We have all been driving down the freeway at 59 in a 55 mph zone and not been pulled over. But if you get pulled over and the radar says 59, you are subject to whatever penalty the officer decides to give you. He may pull you over and tell you to slow down, he may write you a warning or he could give you a citation. If you don't want to be paying tickets, adjusting your cruise control to 54 mph will save you the hassle.

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by billken

Until Honigs starts selling protractors, we are faced with a judgment call.

Don't give them any ideas! It may be a matter of time before they come out with MLB protractors. Of course, amateur umpires will then rush out to get the same thing.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by UMP25

but then my assignor removed me from a DH in May in which this head coach's team was the visiting team, and because my assignor has nothing else for me that day, I lose money.

That's the only home date in that conference on that day? Why not just swap you with another umpire so all originally assigned get to work?

(Or, tell me what day it is and if I'm open, I'll take the game and withdraw the above suggestion. )

[Rich]

Originally Posted by UMP25

Don't give them any ideas! It may be a matter of time before they come out with MLB protractors. Of course, amateur umpires will then rush out to get the same thing.

Or they'll draw a line on the field, which will be just as accurate as the running lane.

[Dave Reed]

KJUmp,
If you want to talk about apples, oranges and thread hijackings, don't hijack this thread. Start a new one.

[Kevin Finnerty]

Originally Posted by billken

We have all been driving down the freeway at 59 in a 55 mph zone and not been pulled over. But if you get pulled over and the radar says 59, you are subject to whatever penalty the officer decides to give you. He may pull you over and tell you to slow down, he may write you a warning or he could give you a citation. If you don't want to be paying tickets, adjusting your cruise control to 54 mph will save you the hassle.

Fifty-nine?? You go down a freeway at anything under 70 around here and you'll get rear-ended.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by billken

Until Honigs starts selling protractors, we are faced with a judgment call.

I've had a coach come out on me and argue that he had 45 degrees as he pointed to the divot that the pitcher's front foot made when he picked the kid off at 3rd. I told him that I didn't have a protractor to determine if it was 44 degrees or 46 degrees, so he was just going to have to live with my call.

The bottom line is that the 45 degrees is a thumb rule, but the actual rule says "directly".

1. When a coach starts pointing at spots I advise him not to demonstrate on the field. If he continues, he's done for the day.

2. 45 degrees is not, for professionally trained umpires, and should not for other umpires, be a "thumb rule". Did the pitcher step more towards home than first? Then he better pitch.

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE=UMP25;673479]

From my own experiences and those of my peers who share theirs with me in casual conversations...


Flash forward to the evening, when the gentleman who assigned me this game, a colleague of mine, tells me the head coach in question didn't wait until after the day was over to call and complain about me. The @ss called my assignor immediately after the first game ended, in-between games. Wow. I think I set a precedent, because in 33 years of umpiring, I've never had a coach or manager complain about me that quickly.

What makes things worse, I think, is that my assignor tells me that I'm scheduled to see this same team on the road in May, and that I'll "most likely be removed from that doubleheader," with no replacement game being offered.

Thanks for sharing and this thread brings to mind the following:

1. Homers
2. Why there are problems
3. The guilty go unpunished.

Not necessarily in the above order but IMO prevalent.

Here we had one coach bump you and the other follow you all the way to the parking lot and your "assignor" is not mad at them. What consequences if any do these rat coaches get. Oh yeah they get to call the assignor and get who they want next time.

Let's face it the Home coach wants a "homer" an umpire who will "look the other way" and rule in his favor.

This is why it's difficult umpiring today. It's my gut that the personality traits displayed in the OP did not happen overnight. The problem: someone had the audacity to call them "on the carpet"

Others most likely "let it go" so they could get the assignments and did NOT want to upset the "Apple Cart". This is typical in both HS (which I know firsthand) and also College (been told to me by officials at that level)

Ok what is the remedy.

Re-examine your umpiring goals
if the answer is "heck with the BIG game because the "price" is to high to pay" then you look for a different association or call Travel ball (Decent baseball and you can make almost as much money with FAR LESS heachaches)

or Call it a career and do something else

Pete Booth

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

2. ...Did the pitcher step more towards home than first? Then he better pitch.

Which is exactly what I told this head coach and why I called the balk. Of course, for doing my job and explaining this, he calls my assignor, my assignor removes me from a $200 doubleheader road game involving this same team on some weekday in May, end of story.

[billken]

After last night, I'd have to say yes to the OP's question!

I balked a kid twice in the first inning for not coming set...flapping his mit during the stop which was not discernible. The second time the coach came out for an explanation and told me that I must be really great because I was the only umpire in this kid's 4 year career that had ever called it. I couldn't resist..."I don't know about everyone else coach, but I am pretty good!"

Funny thing, the kid quit doing it after the second balk call!!!

[UMP25]

Must be something with calling balks that is making coaches go nuts this year. I had two balks yesterday that both scored a runner. In fact, the home team lost 3-2. Both their runs came off the run-scoring balks, kind of weird after they won the first game 13-8.

The balks were rather obvious, too, and when each time the head coach questioned us, he went away not so pissed. His pitcher actually went the distance, pitching a good game. He just got confused a few times there on the rubber and it showed.

[TheShadowKnows]

3 weeks into the HS Season, it appears to be the same suspects are just being themselves. My only problem has been, I have been assigned more games with these yahoos. Last night, doing the dish was a perfect case in point, the visiting coach was whining from the get go about my strike zone, "too low' inconsistant, not calling high strikes", etc.

The problem with this veteran coach is his players feed off the fine whine he dishes out, I warned him in the 6th when he came out to talk to his pitcher, and used the trip back to the dugout to beetch about the zone again. His starting pitcher, who became the catcher when he blew a 4-1 lead, whined from the mound, whined from behind the plate. The coach has rubbed off well, and of course it spreads to a couple of "Daddy Fans" in the stands behind home plate. Warned the Coach, warned the player, ignored the fans. He ended up blowing a lead and got beat 6-4, dumping him down in the league standings, I'm sure I was the reason his team lost.

In General with a dozen Varsity contests and 3 JV games under my belt, 9 or 10 behind the plate, I'm thinking it's no worse than previous years. The loser/whiners are still just that, The quality coaches that know the game, complain on occasion, but never let it get to them, or make it personal. After all they are just being coaches, the others are being and are "Jerks", nothing has changed.